VIC Birth LOOKUP REQ Please! -

[Aussie Pom]

Thanks for all the interesting information. I did come across the Moonambel cemetery too.

Just to clarify something, it would seem according to the 1851 census, that James WILDS (jnr) was illegitimite? If the head of the family (James WILDS snr) states James, aged 10, is his 'wife's child' and that there is no father listed on the FreeBMD search which has his birth recorded as KEMP (Mother's maiden name).

So i probably won't know who the real father is then?

Charlotte

[judb]

No, I don't think you will be able to find the father's name    You could apply to UK for his birth certificate but it may not give you any further information.

This MAY be Anne's baptism, according to the census entry her birth would be about 1821, and according to the death information she was born about 1820.  Also the name is different.  However she may have been baptised as a child rather than as a baby.

Hannah KEMP Christening:  05 MAR 1826   Soberton, Southampton, Hampshire, England, parents;
 James Kemp and Elizabeth 

Edit to add:

Have just found them in 1841, living in the 'tything of Easthoe',  Soberton, all born in Hampshire
James Kemp 65 ag labourer
Elizabeth Kemp 55
John Kemp 25 ag labourer
Sarah Kemp 30
Ann Kemp 20
James Kemp 15 ag labourer
George Kemp 12
Harriet Kemp 9
Martha Kemp 7
James Kemp 6 Mo

Unfortunately the 1841 census does not show relationships, but it seems that Ann is living with her parents with baby James.

Cheers,   
   

[OzDazz]

Hi, I just stumbled upon this forum since renewing my interest in family history research, and thought the following might be of some interest to some of you.

I am descended from James Wilds. My late grandmother's grandmother was Harriet Wilds, daughter of James Wilds & Ann(i)e Kemp.  In the late 70s, my grandmother told us that one of her ancestors, a Wilds, was a convict, transported to Australia for stealing.  My sister had written the name down into her school assignment, but this has since been lost.  All I remember was that the name started with a "J".  Years later, I searched indexes and found the connection to James Wilds and Anne Kemp but got no further.  For some reason I thought the convict ancestor was John, not James, so I didn't think that I had found the convict ancestor.

Anyway, I just conducted another search on convictions in England which resulted in transportation and found a John Wilds who was transported to Australia in 1838 for pickpocketing (10 year sentence).  He was 21 years of age.  The James Wilds who died in Talbot in 1896 at age 79 would have been born around the same time (~1817) as John Wilds, so there is a possibility that they are one and the same.  John might have changed his name to James, perhaps to get away from his convict past.  If James Wilds Jr was born around 1847/1848, that is around the time John/James would have completed his 10 year term. One wonders if he had fathered the child while he was a convict and didn't want to later confess to this? (speculation, I know...)

Further information for those not local...Cochranes Creek is the area around Bealiba and is not far from Molliagul.  Its west of Bealiba, between Logan and Molliagul.

I hope this helps some of you.  I appreciate the information you all have provided.

cheers,

Darren

[cando]

Hi Darren

Welcome to rootschat

I am sure AussiePom will be delighted with your information.  I haven't re-read the thread but remember spending a bit of time researching. Pleased we were able to give some useful information.

Don't hesitate to ask if you think we can help you in anyway.  Lots of keen and knowledgeable people always willing to help others with their research.

Cheers
Cando

[OzDazz]

Thanks, Cando

I re-read the thread and saw the mention that James Jr was born in Portsmouth, England, so that explains him having a different father.

Noted that James Sr's wife and mother were both Kemps.  Coincidence?

Just some further details, for anyone reading who might be interested.

Harriet Elizabeth Wilds married Samuel Collins and had daughter Lily (need to check if there were others).  Lily married John Harvey and they had 7 children (one still alive, in her 80s), including my grandmother.  They lived at Lamplough until their later years.  John was a very private man, having come to Australia as a boy with his mother and brother to get away from an abusive father...his mother died though and he was put into an orphanage at Amphitheatre.  My family have a photo of Lily  (my great-grandmother) taken in the 1940s.  Anyone needing more details, please let me know.

Regards,

Darren

[cando]

Harriet Elizabeth Wilds married Samuel Collins and had daughter Lily (need to check if there were others).

OzDazz

WILDS Harriet Elizabeth born Bealiba
COLLINS Samuel born Adelaide
1880  Reg#3498

Births
COLLINS Ernest George
Father Samuel  Mother Harriett Elizabeth WILDS
At Moonabel  1881  Reg#18111

COLLINS Annie Mary
Father Samuel  Mother Harriet Elizabeth WILDS
At Moonabel  1881  Reg#25199

COLLINS Lilly
Father Samuel Mother Elizabeth WILDS
At Moonabel  1885  Reg#19856

COLLINS William James
Father Samuel   Mother Harriet WILDS
At Moonabel  1889  Reg#14704

Cheers
Cando

[cando]

This may be Samuel's birth in SA as I noticed a death for a Samuel COLLINS, 67 years in 1921 at Maryborough  Reg#10761

COLLINS Samuel
2 Jun 1854
Father Samuel COLLINS  Mother Mary Jane Clarke PEARN
At Bowden    Ade 4/330

Cheers
Cando

[Aussie Pom]

Hi Darren

Thanks for your additional info, very interesting!!!

I have a copy of the 1851 UK census which has James WILDS and wife Ann (nee KEMP), their daughter Clara aged 1 and Ann's son, James WILDS aged 10. (born James KEMP).

However, i suppose it is possible John/James was transported in 1838 for 10 years and then came back to England?

I did find a criminal record for a James WILDS who was convicted on 27/12/1859 at Brighton Town Hall in Sussex for 'Larceny after previous conviction'. His sentance was ' 1 month hard labour, except 3 days in solidary confinement; then to be remanded to a reformatory school, there to be detained for three years'. It hasn't got an age, but i was wondering if this James was being remanded to a reformatory school, could it be he was under 18??
It doesn't say anything about transportation. However, i wonder if this person had commited another crime after being released, would that have resulted in transportation? This crime was already their second offence.

I did originally wonder if this could be the child of Ann and step son of James WILDS....but if so, they were already in Australia by 1859, unless he was left behind or perhaps this is just another James WILDS!

I read with interest your family information from Harriet Elizabeth WILDS. Someone found a 1841 census in Soberton/Droxford, Hamps with possibly the KEMP family. There was a Ann aged 20 and a James aged 6 months there. If it is them, it would appear Ann's mother was Elizabeth and father James. She could have named her son after her father. It also seems Ann may of had a sister called Harriet, as there is a Harriet aged 9 residing too. I think this is the family. Too many coincidents.

I couldn't find James WILDS b 1817 Soberton, Hamps in the 1841 census, so maybe he was in Australia!!!

You may be interested to know that the illegitamite James WILDS married a Maria CARR in 1876 in Percydale, Vic. Sadly, Maria died a few days after giving birth to their first son, Charles William WILDS in 1876. She was only 18. Charles then, for some unknown reason, changed his surname to WILES! Possibly his father had told him that WILDS wasn't his real surname, but taken from his step fathers surname, so Charles thought nothing of changing it to WILES.

I can email you a copy of the 1851 census if you like or it is available on another well known ancestry web page, if you have membership.

Kind regards

[OzDazz]

Thanks for the reply, Aussie Pom.

You're right, it is possible that James returned to England after he served his sentence...then married and later returned to Australia when the gold rush started. 

I do now have doubts that James was the John Wilds who was sentenced in 1838.  Its a bit hard to believe a court would get someone's name wrong.  Its more believable that their name was spelt incorrectly once they reached Australia.  If something can be found for Benjamin Wilds and Lucy Kemp, that might help.  I realise that some records are not accurate.  Example, my grandmother's death certificate shows her father being a Jolly (it was in fact Harvey) - her aunt had been married to a Jolly...so Lucy Kemp might have been a relative of Ann Kemp, and Benjamin Wilds might have been another relative to James...next of kin at time of death?

I have just had a break-thru (just before I posted this message...lucky I did one more search!)...I found when James & Ann came to Australia!

Ship Lady McDonald, July 1852:

WILD   JAMES   34
WILD   CLARA   2
WILD   ANN           31
WILD   JAMES   11

I know information can get distorted over the years as its passed down the generations, so I'm not discounting the notion that it was James' father or brother who was the convict in the family.

I did find on another topic some info on James Wiles the convict:

1823 19 Jul Convicted at Huntingdon 1823 Age 35years

1823 Sentence Life transportation

1824 Jul 17 convict landed from the "Countess of Harcourt" (3) and forwarded to Minto for distribution

1824 Sep 3 & 10 prisoner assigned Richard Kemp, George St Prisoners Barracks Sept. 10 John Gaggin, George St

1824 Ticket of Leave #38/768

1825 Mar 8 Servant of William Elderkine, tailor. Petition for free passage for his wife Isabella and five children

1825 Jul 19 convict who has money lodged in the Savings Bank of New South Wales

1844 Conditional Pardon #761

It also said the last child was born around 1818 and that they had 6 children (yet only 5 came with her).  I wonder, could this be James Wilds' parents?

I'm glad there's so much stuff online these days and I look forward to delving right into it once the World Cup is over!  And hopefully someday we can put this one to bed

cheers,

Darren