Attitudes to a suicide in the 1920s

[coombs]

When my ancestor committed suicide in 1894 the death cert says he was of an unsound mind. newspaper reports say that he had threatened to kill himself before. A neighbour said he was a bit strange but not enough to kill himself. Jesse Titshall had both his parents and his wife but he must have had severe depression. His son Richard, my great grandfather moved from Suffolk to South Essex in about 1904.

Jesse was a miller.

[Geoff-E]

My ancestor died thus - Killed himself by a pistol shot while temporarily insane under the influnce of drink.

Newspaper report here http://www.cultrans.com/carlisle-journal/may-01-1891/4773-suicide-with-a-revolver

[J.R.Ellam]

I have found out that several members of my family have committed suicide.
I have read the inquest and they do say of unsound mind or suffering temporay insanity.
I think it was just a way of justifying their actions in that on one in sound mind would commit such a desperate act.
But when you read a lot of the inquest you have to wounder if they where right especially for the ones that drowned. The way I read some of them they could just have slipped and fell in the water. Or one of my grandfathers cousins was said to have gut her throat with her right had using her fathers razor but my grandfather said she was lefthanded.
But on the topic of burials I think if you paid the church enough for the burial they would allow you to be buried in the church grounds.

John

[Maggie1895]

My ancestor died thus - Killed himself by a pistol shot while temporarily insane under the influnce of drink.
Newspaper report here http://www.cultrans.com/carlisle-journal/may-01-1891/4773-suicide-with-a-revolver

Geoff, those poor children.   I take it you are descended from one of them?  It must have affected them as they grew up, I know that previous generations were more stoic, but that's a pretty unforgettable experience

[stanmapstone]

But on the topic of burials I think if you paid the church enough for the burial they would allow you to be buried in the church grounds.

John

As posted before
An 1823 statute (Burial of Suicide Act 1823 (4 Geo. IV) legalized the burial of suicides in consecrated ground, but religious services were not permitted until 1882. In the year 1823 it was enacted that the body of a suicide should be buried privately between the hours of nine and twelve at night, with no religious ceremony. In 1882 this law was altered by the Internments (felo de se) Act, 1882. where every penalty was removed except that internment could not be solemnised by a burial service, and the body could now be committed to the earth at any time, and with such rites or prayers as those in charge of the funeral thought  fit or were able to procure.

Stan

[oldcrone]

Thanks for all these thoughts/information/personal experiences, etc to my original post.  For some reason, my hotmail account isn't registering these replies!

Meles: yes, my g-grandfather's suicide is registered as having happened when he was 'of unsound mind'.  I can imagine, certainly in the 20s when my forebear committed suicide, that widespread understanding of mental health issues was pretty poor.  My own take is that the Victorian value of 'the stiff upper lip' was still holding sway, and depression (as a psycho/social phenomenon) was something that was frowned upon and given short shrift.

I received a copy of the 1922 newspaper report yesterday and, although the circumstances of my g-grandfather's death are pretty gruesome, there's not that much to really explain why he did it.  But looking at the suicide all these years after the event, there are a few facts to take into account: my g-grandfather survived WW1.  I haven't been able to find his service records but his wife states (with irony, I think) that he survived WW1 'with no injury'.  I wonder though, what psychological affect the war might have had on him.  There is some talk of him being depressed about business worries (he is recorded as being a 'dining rooms proprietor' - I guess this means he ran a cafe).  Whatever, he got up on a Monday morning, went into the coalshed and cut his throat, apparently almost severing his head.  According to his wife, there didn't seem to have been any warning.

(I have more to say, but Rootschat is playing up!  It's really difficult to write my post as the message section keeps flicking up and down.  I'll try again later!)

Clara X

[oldcrone]

One thing I really don't know what to do: do I tell my mum?  My grandfather, son of the cut-throat, has always been persona-non-grata in our family as he deserted my grandmother when my mum and her brother were quite young: he ended up in Australia and married bigamously.  There are no photos/information about him that have been handed down and consequently, it's been really difficult to research this branch of the family.

My mum (aged 78), however, has always had this thing about her 'Welsh' background (ie the Davies family), and seems to have built some sort of celtic fantasy about it.  I've spoken to my 81-year-old uncle about this suicide to find out whether he had any knowledge about it, and he hasn't: this is obviously an occurence that has been keep quiet well before my grandfather met my grandmother.

But, do I tell my mum?  I've spoken to my stepfather, but have only got a non-commital reply.  Should I trash my mum's Welsh fantasies?!

Clara 

[stonechat]

I am still looking for the suicide of my grandmother's aunt, Mary Jane Clarke, who was still alive in the 1911 Census.

My grandmother said she committed suicide, but never managed to find this

[Daisy Loo]

But, do I tell my mum?  I've spoken to my stepfather, but have only got a non-commital reply.  Should I trash my mum's Welsh fantasies?!

Clara 

Clara, if it were my decision, I would say no, don't trash her fantasy, unless she ASKS - if the topic was kept hush hush, then in all probability, she knows nothing about it, so to what ends would you tell her?  Just an opinion anyway