Harriet & Isabella (Bella) McDonald in Toronto, Canada

[Jacquie in Canada]

The marriage registration to Harriet indicates he was a bachelor. It could be his first marriage. It's not unheard of. I don't see any other marriages for him in the Ontario database.

Jacquie

[RSMACL]

Thanks Jacqui - well that clears that up.  Now, on to the next problem!!!

[bigmac1x]

Hi Debbie, Jacquie and Ruth,
Thanks for all your help with these elusive McDonalds et al.
(Thanks for the reminder Jacquie. Donald, Donald, Donald.)
I blew up that UK Incoming Passenger List and never in a million years would I have suspected it was a 4. It looks so clearly like a 9. BUT, with his age on the return trip being 8, and they were there 4 months, 4 does seem to be what it should be. But still couldn't be George's Son. Need his birth record! I've heard they will release records for relatives, is that right?

I went through the censuses and Toronto street directories from 1890 to 1950. Initially to track Joseph as he moved around. Would have been nice if every directory had him as Joseph and not Jos in one year and as John in 1903! He was easy to follow around. The 1901 census has him living with his Sister, Janet (Widow) and her Son at 69 Teraulay St in Toronto. Shows him as Single. No indication of any Wife isabella on the directories up until he married Harriet in 1914. As I got into the 19teens I followed Harriet and Isabella after they arrived in Toronto. Harriet disappears after she married Joseph and then reappears after he dies as a Widow. Seems Wives often didn't get listed in these directories. Harriet disappears again after she remarries to Fadden. The directories for Charles C Fadden after their marriage in 1920 are really not there at all either. I know their address. I'll have to check them that way. And then in 1927 Charles starts showing up on a semi-regular basis. I wonder if they moved to Quebec for a few years? No that's not right - they had a Son here who died here at age 3.
Isabella and Harriet worked at Simpsons Department Store in 1914. Isabella marries in 1915. The Isabella at Simpsons disappears. BUT in 1915 ther's an Isabella working across the street at Eatons Department Store. And she continues to show up as Isabella McDonald even though she married Geroge Murrell in 1915. Will have to pull up Murrell directories to see if he's living at the same address as this Isabella working at Eatons. He dies 1918 and she remarries to Wiles 1920. In 1925 this Isabella is still showing up as a McDonald and still a Clerk at Eatons. I wonder if she's the right one? I'll have to do a Wiles search from 1920 forward in the directories and see if his and this Isabella's address are the same.
Sorry for rambling. Here's the last bit. While following Joseph around I came across enlistment papers for Robert William McDonald b.26 dec 1897 and a William McDonald b.6 jul 1893. Both list Mother as an Isabella (this is where we thought Joseph might have had a first wife with that name). BECAUSE, Robert William in 1918 shows his address as 5 Peter St. This is where Joseph lives with Wife Harriet!. These two have to be related to Joseph somehow. If Joseph is not their Father, he must be an Uncle. What do you think?

[Jacquie in Canada]

I've heard they will release records for relatives, is that right?

IIRC, first you would have to prove that George is dead and then you would have to meet the criteria of next of kin to obtain a birth registration for someone whose birth is covered by privacy laws. This site has a link to the terms and conditions that apply to who can order a certificate:
https://www.orgforms.gov.on.ca/eForms/start.do?lang=en

I found a birth for Robert William McDonald (he was born in September, not December according to his attestation papers and birth registration) and he was the son of William McDonald and Isabella Campbell. According to William and Isabella's marriage registration, William's parents were Robert McDonald and Agnes Pringle Kerr so William was Joseph's brother and Robert William was his nephew.

I also found the birth for William McDonald and his parents were James McDonald and Isabella Florence.

Jacquie

[Jacquie in Canada]

The following marriages are in the Ontario marriage database:

William McDonald, 30 born Coldstream, Scotland, son of Robert McDonald and Agnes Pringle Kerr married Isabella Campell, 30, born Caithness, Scotland, daughter of George Campbell and Sophia Levach on 14 Oct 1896 in Toronto, York County, Ontario

Robert McDonald, 24, born Berwickshire, Scotland, son of Robert McDonald and Agnes P Kerr  married Margaret E Clark, 31, born Manvers, daughter of James Clark and Sarah Fromey(?) on 19 Dec 1894 in Manvers Twp., Durham County, Ontario.

Robert McDonald, 46, born Coldstream, Scotland, son of Robert McDonald and Agnes Pringle Kerr married Jessie Anne Hastings, 31, born Metz Ontario, daughter of Alexander Hastings and Martha Henderson on 4 Dec 1918 in Woodstock, Oxford County, Ontario.

John Kerr McDonald, 40, Coldstream, Scotland, son of Robert McDonald and Agnes Kerr married Eliza Jane Irvine, 36, born Toronto, daughter of Gerald Irvine and Charlotte Crozier on 30 Mar 1915 in Erindale, Peel County, Ontario.

Agnes McDonald, 23, born Scotland, daughter of Robert McDonald and Agnes Care married William Steel, 35, born Scotland, son of John Steel and Mary McPherson on 29 Mar 1892 in Peterborough, Peterborough County, Ontario.

It seems likely that Agnes McDonald's mother was actually Kerr, not Care and her or William Steel's accent caused the misspelling.

Jacquie

[bigmac1x]

Hi Jacquie,
I think we've been doing the same things today - and fortunately came to the same conclusions re Robert William. He was Joseph's Nephew.

Discovered the second enlistment name I gave you, William b.1893 is not related. This is the one you were referring to when you said:
I also found the birth for William McDonald and his parents were James McDonald and Isabella Florence.Right?

I think you've filled in a few other blanks too with the list of marriages. Thanks. I'll check those out tomorrow as tonight is bowling night. Yay!

I'm going to pop up to the library tomorrow as well to do a couple of those name and address thingys I mentioned earlier. Thanks again for ALL your help, guidance, support and confirmation.

Stephen

[bigmac1x]

Does anyone remember:
I seem to recall someone sending me a border crossing from Canada to the USA about 1947-1949. It was either a link or an attachment.
It was one of Isabella's Sons, Raymond or Wilmot Wiles going to the USA. With one of them was “Mother” in the upper right box.
I have found both of Raymond’s and Wilmot’s immigration cards and no “Mother” to be seen on either. I must be going bonkers!
One was with his Wife, Lorraine. The other was with his Son, Ronlad (but no wife).
Does any of this ring a bell?
I’ve searched for Isabella, Bella/Wiles, Mcdonald and nothing. I know she had a USA SSN in 1951 and died in California in 1986. There's a border crossing somewhere.
Maybe it was sent by email. I guess I’ll have to go back through all my emails and search for a key word.
Thanks for any help.