Harriet & Isabella (Bella) McDonald in Toronto, Canada

[cosmac]

Form 30As are found in the immigration/shipping lists on ancestry for the years 1919-1924.  These forms were filled out by passengers in the UK and listed place of birth, Canadian contacts and British contacts, reason for immigrating etc. 

This documentation gives you the middle name of Isabella's daughter but wasn't posted to try and solve the parentage of George.

Debbie

[bigmac1x]

Hi Debbie,
Tried the UK Incoming search using the parameters you suggested. Nothing. Tried all kinds of variations and still nothing.

[bigmac1x]

Isabella's Daughter's middle name, June. Should probably be Jane after her Aunt's second name - but who knows for sure?

[J.J.]

Jacquie & cosmac...Wow, you're both doing a bang up job of slugging away at this thread...  I'm amazed at how much has been found considering well into the 20th century...J.J.
 

[bigmac1x]

With so much talent working on this mystery - how could we fail?
Stephen

[Jacquie in Canada]

Hi Debbie,
Tried the UK Incoming search using the parameters you suggested. Nothing. Tried all kinds of variations and still nothing.

If you search the incoming UK passenger list database using the following you will find at least daughter Isabella:

Isab* Mur*l

When I search using that I get 4 hits but only one of them is for a voyage dated 1920 and it is listed as Isabella Muriel born about 1917.

As for son George, if he was illegitimate then Isabella could have covered it up by registering his birth under her late husband's name (maybe that was why she married her 2nd husband so quickly). Isabella certainly couldn't have been pregnant with him after her husband died because she would have been pregnant with Donald George who died in 1919 at age 6 months.

Jacquie

[bigmac1x]

What frustrating websites! I enter the same details on ancestry.ca, uk and com and get different answerrs. Finally got the right ship.

Interesting they went to Liverpool - unless the ship went on to Glasgow.
Stayed in UK for 4 months.
George F Jr on the way over is 9 months old.
On the way back he is 8 months old.
Both ages don't make sense.

Assuming George Jr's 9 months old on the way over is correct. Then he was born Sep 1919. Conceived Dec 1918. Dad died 2 months earlier.
The younger age on the way back still doesn't work.

We know Isabella had Daniel in Apr 1919. Died 6 months later in Oct 1919. This means he was conceived Jul 1918, 2 months before dad's death. That works.

AND, Daniel b.Apr 1919 and George Jr b.Sep 1919. I don't think so!

What am I missing?

[Jacquie in Canada]

Assuming George Jr's 9 months old on the way over is correct. Then he was born Sep 1919. Conceived Dec 1918. Dad died 2 months earlier.
The younger age on the way back still doesn't work.

We know Isabella had Daniel in Apr 1919. Died 6 months later in Oct 1919. This means he was conceived Jul 1918, 2 months before dad's death. That works.

AND, Daniel b.Apr 1919 and George Jr b.Sep 1919. I don't think so!

What am I missing?

That George wasn't 9 months when he went to England but was actually 4 months. Going from the return information he was 8 months when they came back after being there for 4 months. I think what looks like a 9 on the incoming passenger list is actually a 4 with the top closed in a loop, not a 9. That would make George's birth date around Feb 1920.

And you've got Daniel on your brain - Donald George - remember.

[RSMACL]

So grateful to everyone who has been 'banging away' on these two ladies and discovering so much of their history. 
Could we please just go back to our Harriet for a moment?   
Both cousin Stephen (bigmac1x) and I now think that  Harriet Jane McDonald's first husband  JOSEPH MCDONALD (she was b. 30 July 1891 Resolis, Scotland)  he was born 16 July, 1967 Coldstream, Scotland), could have been married before in Canada, as he was 41 yrs. when he married Harriet (23 yrs) in Toronto, Canada on 9th April, 1914.
Joseph emigrated to Canada in 1890 when 23 yrs. of age.   Surely it seems possible that he would have married at some stage soon after that.
Have fairly comprehensive coverage of his working life in Toronto up to and including 1918 Census - he worked as a Driver/Foreman  for "Hendrie & Co.", Cartage Contractors for the Canadian Pacific Railways. He died in Oct. 1919, Toronto, Canada (51 yrs.).  Haven't also been able to locate any children, either of his possible first marriage, nor of the marriage to Harriet.  How do I trace any earlier marriage?  Thanks once again for all your great help, Aussie Ruth