Can anyone help please.

[Kathc]

Hi all

I have a copy of the 1911 census, with my husbands grandfather & grandmother on it plus 3 children, our name is Clews, but on the census his grandfather has spelt it Clewes, it is the correct address in Middlesbrough.

John Clewes age 31 born Barnard Castle ( Durham )

Alice Martha Clewes age 26 born Graves End

Jonathan H Y Clewes age 7 born Knaresborough

Gladys May Clewes age 5 born Middlesbrough

John Norman Oswald Clewes age 3 born Middlesbrough

Can not find Jonathan's birth marriage or death looks like he was born a year before John and Alice married they married in 1905, we know about Glady's and have found John Norman's birth but no Marriage or death.

Can not find the birth of John Born 1880 Barnard Castle, we know his father was William from the marriage cert, and the only Graves End I could find was in Kent, but that doe's not fit, with the info I have for Alice Martha, her maiden name was Kitchen and her fathers name was Marmaduke, I have lots of info on the family of Marmaduke Kitchen, and it seems to be the correct family.

Confused ? me too, any help would be much appreciated. Kathc

[Pels.]

Just to help anyone else who might be wondering about this. Although all the information appears to centre around a similar area, did they marry in the registration district of West Derby, Kath ?

Pels.

[Pels.]

I'm starting to understand what you mean !

When you say you have information about Marmaduke, could you give us a little more information please, I can't find anything on any of them for some unknown reason ?

Have you found either Alice Maud or John on any of the returns ? 

[heywood]

Hello,

I know it's nto what you asked for but for Pels - here is Alice Martha as Martha A in 1901  RG13; Piece: 4575; Folio: 85; Page: 40

It's taken ages to find her- transcribed as Kikhen.

Looked for the family in 1911 indexes - transcribed as Cleeves 

Kath,
I was thinking that Jonathan may be Kitchen in birth registers - but can't find him anyway - he is Jonathan Henry in 1911 indexes.

Does John's age fit on the marriage certificate with 1880 and what is his occupation please?

Wonder too why they married in West Derby 

heywood

[Pels.]

Hello, I am impressed, thanks very much Heywood !! 

This is the second time today I've had the feeling that I've looked for something before and not found anything then either ? Until Kath returns, here are a few more details about the family :

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,218613.0.html

[Pels.]

May as well post them all and then it saves us looking !! 


http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,189400.0.html

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,180879.0.html

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,384179.0.html

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,280940.0.html

[heywood]

Reading the other threads, it looks like I'm more than likely wrong re Alice in 1901 

Also Kath, saw that Harry Kitchen birth in Knaresborough and see that it has already been mentioned. I think it would be worth following up.

[Kathc]

Hi Pels & Heywood

Thank you for your replies, you have helped me before Pels.
Yes they married in Bootle, West Derby in 1905, there ages are John 23 and Alice 21.
John Clews died age 78 in 1958 in Middlesbrough.
Alice Martha died age 56 in 1940 in Middlesbrough

I have the census for the Kitchen family, from 1861 to 1901 that (Ambly) from rootschat, sent me some years ago, but on the 1891 census Marmaduke is mis enumerated as Rob't there is a daughter Martha A, I have been told the A is Ann, yet a lady named Trish, her grandmother is the child Henrietta, and she was married from 19 Marl St in Middlesbrough, the same address as John and Alice, now most of the children of Marmaduke Kitchen are born in Hury, Yorkshire, so why has John on the 1911 census put Graves End as his wife's birth place?

A cousin of mine who lives in Birmingham has tried to help, he found on the 1901 census a John Clews age 17, living in Durham with a family named Coskin, he is down as stepson.
Head of house Robert W Coskin age 40, wife Mary Coskin age 40, he found there marriage in 1885 her name was Clews so was she a widow ?

And I was just browsing, on surnames on rootschat, and found a (sarag) who is looking for a George Clews 10 Burns St, Bootle, that is the address on the marriage cert of John and Alice, I have put three post's on the Lancashire board but no luck as this person has no posts so I can not make contact.

Kathc
 

[heywood]

Hi Kath,

I had seen that stepson and wondered about him. He is Coskin in 1891. I have looked at 1881 and can see a Mary Clews who fits with her mother, Ann and siblings
1881 RG11; Piece: 4968; Folio: 87; Page: 59

and in 1871  RG10; Piece: 4985; Folio: 22; Page: 2
the family have John Clews as head.

There is a brother (to Mary) George born 1858 but I can't be sure of him in later censuses but there are none in Bootle up to 1901.
It looks that John Clews born c 1883 to Mary would be illegitimate.

In many cases, a father's name is invented so this could be a possibility but that is all at the moment. I hope that you can contact sarag at some point - that may be a big help.

heywood