Abney Park Cemetery Problems Getting Information

[medhist]

Hello
Could anyone tell me the best way to approach getting information on people buried here and listed in their online index Please?  I have repeatedly emailed Hackney Archives and the APC Trust but they never reply.

I have loads of ancestors buried there and would like to know who owned their graves plots and any other people buried with those listed, such as spouses.  I am reluctant to send £15 per person to DErek Hopkins in Canada as his website has not been updated since 2001. The APCTrust information is not terribly up to date either. 

Does anybody know whether it is still safe to send off the research requests and payment to Derek Hopkins at the address he gjves in Canada?  There are such a lot of burials so it would be a hefty amount to send off on Spec!

I would be really grateful if anyone has done this recently and can assure me that I won't be losing cash.

Thanks

[chirp]

It does seem awful hard to find out anything about Abney Park Cem. I see that the Trust's website is currently being updated so hopefully the new version will be better. There used to be a Friends of Abney Park group but I don't see reference to that now though there is a similar group for children.  I hope too that the new site gives full contact details. To be fair I don't know if this is something which is run completely or partly by volunteers and I don't doubt that there are lots of good things happening in regard to educational/environmental and historical events, many aimed at children, but the online information does need a lot of improvement. My advice is not to go sending off your money. I have emailed Abney Park today as I want to know more about their "digital photograph of memorial stones" offer and am uncertain how to go about this. If I learn any more I will post the information here.
Chirp

[Plummiegirl]

Have you just tried calling the cemetary office.  The hardest part of this task is getting hold of the office number, you have to in some cases do some digging around phone books & websites.

I have done this in the past (not Abney Park) & have found the staff in most cemetaries very knowledgable & helpful.  And in one case as I knew the grave number, they even went to have a look to see if there was a marker of any kind on the grave, they called me back & told me there was not one.  This saved me a lot of time traipsing across London to visit an unmarked grave, having done this before it is very disappointing.  They  were also able to tell me who owned the grave from their records.

If you live within the M25 it may be worthwhile visiting, you never know.

I did a look up for someone in a one of the 3  in Woolwich (SE London) & once found out the right one, the groundsmen I spotted helped me to find the grave I was looking for.  IF not for them would never have found it, although in numerical order, the numbers changed dramatically on the next row.  Took some photos, sadly not a grave with a gravestone, but one with a low "wall" type memorial around it, with names & dates on, but due to age very badly worn.

Do not know if this info helps, but it's all worth a try.

[medhist]

Thanks to both of you.  I wish it were possible to visit although it was a closed in 1978 as a cemetery and is now a Park.  I live in Swansea so too faraway  to visit.  I have heard it is very neglected and overgrown by people who have attempted it. 
The trust  has made such an effort to index people buried there and putting them online but if they have common names it is difficult to know whether you have found your correct relative or not.

I really hope I can have  success with more emails.  I have not managed to find a  telephone number.  Derek Hopkins has supposedly a website but the link on the site is broken.

I shall persevere!
Thanks

[dawnsh]

Hi there

http://www.abney-park.org.uk/about

there is an email link to 'Lisa' and a phone number. You may have to leave a message on their answerphone

Dawn

[medhist]

Thanks. I have emailed Lisa numerous times.  Also no reaction to leaving phone messages . I think that number is just to do with joining the FRiends of Abney Park.  I shall keep trying though.

[Plummiegirl]

Right think this might be of some help

Go to Google enter - Abney Park Cemetary - then go to the - Wikipedia - entry (very informative) then right down the bottom are links to other sites look at the - FLICKR - site lots of photos & names, you might be able to contact the photographers.

[medhist]

Thank you.  The pics are great and your idea brilliant.  They give a really good idea of how it looks. I shall try to contact a few of the photographers.

[Valda]

Hi

Just to put it in context a little - Abney Park Cemetery occupies 32 acres some of which when I visited it was considerably overgrown (the older parts of the cemetery are a nature reserve and it took a bit of macheting even in February to reach the gravestones I was looking for). It is a very large cemetery and you really need plot numbers and a map if you are to find gravestones, if you know gravestones are likely to be there (many families in the past not having the money to either buy a gravestone or a plot). A good indication of whether the families did buy gravestones and plots is whether they left wills and their occupations on censuses. Many gravestones have not survived the ravages of time which included the London air pollution which lasted up to the 1950s.

The Abney Trust (Abney Park Cemetery is privately managed) may be the only ones to hold the registers on plot purchases as opposed to the ordinary cemetery registers the microfilm copies of which are held at Hackney Archives and which have been indexed online.


Cemetery registers usually give the name of the deceased, age, abode and occupation, the date of death and of burial, and the position of the grave. If a private grave was purchased those records will indicate who purchased the plot, their address and when it was purchased and whether a gravestone was erected (though not whether it survives). The records will also indicate who else was buried in the plot, when and at what depths.

If you know your families were likely to be able to buy plots then a search on one name will give all the others buried in the same plot, all of which doesn't help much if the Abney Trust isn't answering emails, though it may be responding if you are filling in forms and sending cheques.

Many Londoners were buried in common graves which contained other burials. Burial in a common grave was not synonymous with a pauper funeral. It did not mean the funeral itself was not paid for by the family it just means they couldn't afford to buy a plot. If that is the case then the information from the burial register will be all the information there is to obtain.


Regards

Valda