Ceeoh's Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In

[stroudie]

Hello Ceeoh

Wow!! I can't quite digest it all, but if all these folk are having difficulty linking relationships among Burnsides, what hope have we got of fitting in a Smith?

I did just wonder, if Mary was from a family of travelers/ tinkers, how likely is it that she would marry outside of the traveling community?

We know a lot about Charles Grout's background and it is much more conventional. He came from Loughton Essex, where the family remained. There is an unproven family story that he fled to escape charges for poaching in Epping Forest. His father was a publican and owned land and property and left a fairly substantial legacy, but divided many ways. Charles and some of his family benefited from the will, so contact with the family appears to have been maintained. Charles was literate.

What is SKS?

[Spidermonkey]

SKS = Some Kind Soul 

[heywood]

Hello,
just got totally lost in the Burnside thread and did not even try to make sense of it all- this is bad enough 
I did note that way back there was a Violetta in the very extended family.

heywood

[stroudie]

Hi Heywood
Yes, I wondered about Violetta.

I am shooting off on tangents, but I'm just trying to check old notes for any clues. One is a marriage given to me by someone else:
James Burton durham central =Mary Burnside 1859

I wonder if this could rule out Mary Burnside, if we can follow this Mary through

[heywood]

In this extended family, there could be lots of Marys  I was hoping that someone had followed up the Edward/Sarah family and accounted for all children.
Wouldn't that be just brilliant 

[stroudie]

As far as i am aware from previous correspondence, no one seems to have followed up Mary Burnside. Does that mean she has no known descendants? She doesn't seem to be found in the 1841 census or 1861, though she could be married by then.

[stroudie]

From the travelers board;

"I'm afraid I do not have the original marriage cert' for Ambrose Burnside and Isabella Gordon, (died 28/11/1898 Airdrie), so I'm no help there  Sad.

Did you know that Isabella went on to marry William Cunningham brn abt 1825 in Oldham, died 4/5/1900 in Airdrie

He was the widower of (I think, but have to confirm the link) her sister Margaret Gordon brn abt 1825 in Oldham."

[Ceeoh]

Hi

With what we have, Mary Smith being a Mary Burnside looks a very good option, the only thing I cannot get my head around is why she would take the name Smith without a reason.

Did Joseph have a father "Smith" but as mentioned previously if a couple lived together and had a child they were regarded as married, and he left "reasons unknown" between census returns.

Perhaps marrying Charles was her way of settling into a more (acceptable) established life.  Going by her Will she was fairly well off by the time she died.

If she had been living by traveller custom in the eyes of the law and the church she would still be a single woman until 1869.  Certainly in 1863 when son Charles was born she didn't seem to know much about Charles senior going by the information she gave on his birth registration.

Margaret

[heywood]

Goodmorning 

The trouble is we don't know why she said what she did - if only ...

When Charles was born, she was presumably known as Smith and as Charles was illegitimate, he has his father's surname as his middle name.
However, calling Charles snr by the name of Smith seems more strange and perhaps that was just a mistake on the part of the registrar or just more 'proper'.
If only we could find Joseph's registration- that may show more because if she followed that thinking above, the father would be Joseph Wingrove!
The son has called himself that in marriage, and it is quite a rare name. It's a funny name to just dream up.
Back to the wondering and thinking 

heywood