Looking for Relatives of Richard Napoleon Wyombe Townsend REECE

[majm]

Hi there,

Try this link, there's a sub-section titled "Where do I begin" (Adoption Jigsaw organisation in OZ)

http://www.jigsaw.org.au/

Also please read through this link http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,142443.0.html

If I may offer a suggestion or two for searching along that path .... to "walk slowly", pausing, thinking always of the up and down sides .... with good intentions, and try always to consider walking in their shoes too. (Your shoes, the adopted person's shoes, the adopting parents shoes, and of course there's the mum who gave birth, the birth dad, the grandparents, aunties/uncles, ...)

There's lots of shoes to consider walking in   

Don't fret or be down-hearted if at first you don't succeed, for tomorrow is another day...

Bestest thoughts

Just Moi

[outback_thunda]

hi there,its just I contacted some people and they said unless I am the adoptive parent or the adopted child then they cant help unless the adoptove mother gives permission or is deceased, this isnt actually me, its a cousin who is trying to find her adopted brother....Me i kow who i am and have 11 confirmed siblingds all over the place and possibly 7-8 more somehwere but have no where to start.LOL

[margaretatwinmalee]

Hello outback-thunda

My husband is a great-grandson of Richard Napoleon Whycom Townsend Reece. We would love to know the origins of Richard’s two middle names.

Following the line to my husband, Annie Adelaide Marddrah married Isaac Reece on 23rd December 1861 in Scone in the upper Hunter Valley. Then on 1st July 1869 Annie Adelaide Reece (listed as a widow) married William Townsend in Warialda. Their son Richard was born in Bingara on 3rd September 1871. Richard then married (as we assume from the birth certificate of their eldest daughter), Mary Jane Latimore (Latimer) on 1st July 1902 at Springridge, Quirindi. This was Mary’s second marriage (with 6 previous children). Richard and Mary’s eldest daughter, Nora May Rose Reece, was born on the 29th June 1903 in Narrabri. Nora married Robert Kelly in 1926 and my mother-in-law Rosemary was born in 1931. Richard died in 1948 in Tamworth and Mary Jane in 1949 in Cessnock.

Like others we have noted the confusion in Richard’s surname. While his birth certificate carries the surname Townsend he was known as Richard Reece by the time of his marriage in 1902. As you probably know, on Annie’s second marriage certificate to Mr Townsend, she is listed as a widow, but I can’t find a death certificate for Isaac Reece prior to that time, though a chap by that name died in 1872 (sorry I don’t have any confirming certificates for this). Perhaps they had split up (or she was a bigamist!!) or maybe we just need to look harder. Nevertheless it appears that Annie Adelaide died in about 1893 in Emmaville and William Townsend married Mary Ann White in about 1894 also in Emmaville. Perhaps there had been acrimony between Annie and William, or between William and Richard causing Richard to revert to his mother’s previous name (it would be interesting to see school records). My mother-in-law knew her grandparents but cannot shed any light on this. Certainly it is the name Reece that carried on through Richard’s children.

We are also a bit mystified by Annie Adelaide Marddrah’s surname.  There are various spellings on different certificates – usually Marddrah or Maddrah. We think it might be pronounced Madiera and various phonetic spellings of it seem to be associated with people who live in or near York. The certificate of her marriage to Isaac Reece is quite confusing with additions in a second hand-writing added after the event from the Church register. Annie’s mother is listed there as both Helen Bearcroft and Helen Steel late Marddrah. Does “late” mean her previous husband’s name or something else? We had found a convict from York, William Madderah who received his Certificate of Freedom in 1836, but we are most interested in the posting that link Benjamin Maddrah with Ellen Beecroft.

Hope this helps
Margaret

[judb]

Hi Margaret, and welcome to Rootschat

This is a very long and complex thread, with a number of red herrings and side-trackings as we have tried to sort out this family.  I would suggest that you may need some time to sort through it and note what information is backed up through reliable sources such as IGI, FreeBMD, convict registers, etc etc. 

Some of your points have been covered from sources - a birth listing on IGI for an Ellen BEARCROFT in Yorkshire (Reply #23), origin of Annie's MADDRAH surname (reply #39), and the marriage of Annie's parents (reply #41) - but, as always, the connections are conjecture.

I don't think we have found the origin of the Whycomb part of Napoleon's name, and it would appear that Annie's connection to the Reece and Townsend surnames were blurred in Napoleon's name usage.

There are certainly many points still needing work and some of them may never be found.

It is a fascinating thread!

Cheers, Judith

[margaretatwinmalee]

Hello Judith and outback_thunda

Thanks for your reply Judith. I spent hours yesterday searching databases in NSW State Records for any hint of the arrival of Benjamin and Ellen Maddrah in Australia. I've put in every combination of Ellen/Uelen/Ursula/Orella with wildcard searching under B, M and Steel/e into the various immigration lists. Have done likewise with NSW B,D and Ms but I can't find anything (I think someone else made that comment in an earlier posting). It's very frustrating.

I've found the reference to the marriage of Benjamin and Ellen in 1839 and it seems reasonable that they are the parents of Annie Adelaide - have any of you sighted the actual marriage certificate. There is a Benjamin Maddrah listed in British census of 1851 but that could be the grandfather. What then happened to Benjamin number 2? Have also noted the convict arrival of an Ellen Beecroft in 1853 in Tasmania but this looks like a red herring - there are quite a lot of Ellen Beecrofts in various UK databases.

Nevertheless how can there be such a gap between the 1839 marriage of Benjamin and Ellen and the marriage of Annie to Isaac Reece in 1861 with no records? From various certificates that I do have, it seems that Annie was born in about 1844 in Parramatta. Before I now spend money at the B,D and Ms registry office trying to find her with no on-line birth registration number available, has anyone got any more search clues or new information?

Thank you all for your help. It's sort of good to know that I'm not the only one frustrated by this.

Margaret

[margaretatwinmalee]

Hello everyone

Just a P.S. to my last posting. The birth certificate for Richard N.W. Townsend has his third name spelt as Whycom. I've wondered if it should have a 'be' on the end (ie Whycombe). It might, or probably might not be a consideration for linking his middle names to other people or places if anyone is that interested.

Cheers
Margaret

[judb]

Hi Margaret,

On reply #41 you have a UK marriage from Free BMD which I believe is most probably Benjamin and Ellen/Helen/Orella.  The surname of MADDRAH is so uncommon, and the name Ellen Beecroft fits well, but I grant you it is circumstantial.

 The description of the Ellen BEECROFT convict fits well with the later age evidence for Orella STEELE.  The convict has (from memory) 4 children left behind in UK.  The convict Ellen arrived in Tasmania so probably no record of arrival in NSW; I don't believe Benjamin came to Australia.  The reference to the UK children (cannot find any reg for them) and the gadding about in Yorkshire of the Ellen convict could well account for some of missing time. 

Annie could well have been born out of wedlock, registered under another name (although I can't see any 'Annie Adelaide' registered NSW 1835-1850), not registered at all, or born in Tasmania (if Ellen is the convict). 

This bit is only my opinion but this lady seems to have been fairly laid back as to which forename she used at various times in her life.  I would not be surprised if she was happy to change surnames at times also - she may have taken on the STEELE surname without a legal marriage.   

Details given on certificates in this search are fairly unreliable also - even Annie has 7 and 1/2 years between her two marriages (Dec 1861 and July 1869) but  Annie only ages 2 years.

Cheers, Judith

[margaretatwinmalee]

Hello Judith

Thanks again for the recent information. It has been a number of years since I first tackled this part of the family history (was in 2002 I think) and I basically gave up because of the sort of brickwalls that everyone has been running into. It's most useful to now have an English Maddrah to pursue.

I don't believe there is any more to be gained from searching official NSW records. Like you I've done all the name permutations I can think of. I even tried just going through the Annie births (without Adelaide) for a 15 year period as well - that was fun! I hadn't picked up on the age discrepancies for her however - the plot thickens. I thought that maybe I was on to something when I found William Mudderah the convict but basically decided to call it quits until I retired and could spend time in the archives etc checking up further on him, but maybe we have been looking at the wrong convict. Following your comments the Tasmanian connection might in fact be worth a further look.

You are right about Ellen/Helen being free with her name (one certificate I have names her as Ursula) and this has also caused us problems in tracing other members of the family. I do remember that when I was trying to fill in gaps in the more recent part of the tree that there was constant frustration with lack of official documentation, marriages that weren't, fathers who's status is questionable and sudden name changes.

If I find anything new I'll post the info but I do this irregularly because of work so it may take time (if I find anything new at all). Thanks again for your help.
Margaret

[judb]

Hi again Margaret

I would agree that there is probably little more can be found although perhaps the Historical Society in Warialda/Bingara may be able to dig up more info.

One last question - what is the cert you have with the name Ursula?  I would be interested in the details on that certificate as it has not figured in this thread until you mentioned it.

Cheers, Judith