thomas amott birth ref and 1841/51/61 census

[Agaveman]

Hi there
i would be interested to know if you have go anywhere with thomas. I have been searching for him for some time with mixed success. How do you believe he was also Thomas radcliffe?
Thomas is my gr gr grandfather

[samatk]

we think he may be illegitimate because found a report of his trial which refers to him as thomas amott OR ratcliffe.  There is only one marriage I can find btweeen a francis amot and a hannah ratcliffe.  am happy to send photocopies when I come back from holday in mid september. I am working my way through parish registers for Lancashire starting with Radcliffe but have found nothing asyet....

[heywood]

Hello,
I'm sorry this won't help much but just going with the marriage that I posted a while ago, I noticed these and wonder if you have them. Of course the problem is linking your Thomas to that marriage initially 

1841 HO107; Piece 188; Book: 9;  Folio: 27; Page: 5

Barrow upon Trent Derbyshire

Francis Amat 25 yrs Grit stone cutter born in county

1851 Class: HO107; Piece: 2239; Folio: 232; Page: 36
Tintwistle Cheshire
Francis Amet married lodger 34 yrs Stone scapler b Derbys Holloway

I can't find him in 1861 but there is a death in 1867 Chapel en le Frith which fits.

I wonder if this chap may be the Henry Francis Amott baptised 1813 Crich -parents Thomas and Dorothy. (I found the family through a man called German Amott as name varies quite a bit.)

As I said, sorry it doesn't provide any answers re Thomas. The occupations don't quite fit and nothing to really link the places 

However, Francis has a father, Thomas

best wishes
heywood

[heywood]

Have you seen this- same lodgings as 1871 for Thomas

1861  RG9; Piece: 3452; Folio: 67; Page: 35

Robt Ratcliffe 26 yrs
Thos Ratcliffe 13 yrs
both born Lancashire    no other clues

[heywood]

Going back to that first marriage post- Francis' wife could be Harriet or Hannah.

I can only see a Robert Radcliffe in 1841 with a mother Hannah and father Henry (but no relationships are given of course) and they are living in Radcliffe!
There are other children but I can't see this family in 1851. There is a death for a Henry, 1842, Bury which would fit.  but it is all very tenuous.

[heywood]

Family Search has this marriage:

Henry Ratcliffe and Ann Holt
02 JUN 1828 Saint Peter, Bolton Le Moors

a possibility but Ratcliffe and Holt are not uncommon names and there is nothing positive as they are living in Radcliffe and not Bolton.

A tree on Anc. has a Mary Ellen born to this couple but I can't see her in 1851 either but she appears in BMD and in later censuses.
There is a family group of teenagers/children in Pilkington (born Radcliffe) in 1851 and another Henry Ratcliffe death in Pilkington but this is after the marriage of Hannah/Harriet so all this could be a red herring.

I am adding this (and rambling I fear) because I don't want to raise hopes but on the other hand there could be something.

[samatk]

good grief everyone has been busy...i shall have to print it all out and have a think about it when I return from holiday in mid september...and I hadn't noticved the ratcliffes living with thomas in the census mentioned ...hmmm...all very interesting

[Agaveman]

Hi there

I have been trying to find details of the mentioned trial but without success. Would you be able to provide any further details please?
Many thanks
Simon