South Lancashire Regiment

[er indoors]

Hi I am trying to solve a mystery and hope somebody out there can help me solve it.
I had an uncle Thomas Ross born Liverpool c1889 son of John Henry ans Annie Ross
1911 census he was at Orford barracks corporal age 22.  I know it was him as his sister was also there as a visitor. (he was in infantry)
Family info say's he became a Major but as yet unable to find if this is true what family info there is no body knows where it came from all has some truth but not 100%
I found the WW1 medal Rolls index cards there is a Thomas Ross no 8198 Sgt 2nd bn South Lancashire Reg  M.C after his name so assume military cross France 14.8.14 mentions of clasp/2/330 em/2/171then t/wocl1 was that transport warrant officer class 1?
Found on London gazette may 1917 8198 Thomas Ross Company Sargent Major  and 31st may 1918 8198 T/RSM.
I need to know how I can confirm if theses two Thomas Ross's are the same man if they are he may not have left the Army after the war if he were to get to a higher Rank.
Any idea's?

[jds1949]

As the Regimental number is the same for the London Gazette entries and the Medal Index card, then I think you can be pretty confident that it was the same man. If he did go on to be a Major in the army then it would seem that he served beyond the end of hostilities in 1918. If that is the case then there is a good chance that his records still survive and are held by the Ministry of Defence - see this for further details:

http://yourarchives.nationalarchives.gov.uk/index.php?title=Military_Records

If he was an officer before the end of the war, which doesn't seem likely given the dates of the Gazette entries, then his army record will be at the National Archives at Kew.

A good site for general background and a start for research is:

 http://www.1914-1918.net/

good hunting,

jds1949

[ainslie]

Welcome to the forum
As the same number 8198 appears with all three references to Thomas Ross, it must be at least 99.9% certain that they are for the same man.
The Military Cross was instituted in December 1914 as a gallantry award for junior commissioned officers and warrant officers,  but would not be available to sergeants.  Sergeant-major  is a warrant officer, CSM is WO class 2, Regimental Sergeant major a WO class 1 - a very important figure in an infantry battalion.
I suspect that the 'T/RSM' would have nothing to do with transport, but  be a 'temporary' rank.  If he was commissioned, this would be published in the London Gazette, so more searches there would be worthwhile.
However... CSMs and RSMs were sometimes referred to, informally, as 'major'.
Peninsula Barracks in Orford, Warrington was the South Lancashire Regiment's depot for many years, but all has been transferred under mergers and amalgamations to Fulwood Barracks, Preston, Lancs, where you might get more details.
This site will give you lots of information about the regiment and WW1 in general:  <http://www.1914-1918.net/>.  There is a linked Great War Forum.
A
[beaten to it by jds!]

[er indoors]

Sorry I may not have explained this very well but I have no reg no for corporal Thomas Ross 1911. The numbers refer to the medal card 1914-1920 the references in the Lonson Gazette match his name and number.

Thank's

[jds1949]

If you check back to the 1911 census return it should tell you which Regiment was being enumerated - if it is the South Lancs then it probably is your man - a corporal in 1911 would probably have been a sergeant by the War. Ainslie's point about Sergeant Majors being called "Major" is a good one and would make perfect sense with your family's memory of the man.

jds1949

[er indoors]

Many thanks for your replies and advice nice to know it wan't all a load of rubbish.
now I have the bug I want to know more about this uncle of mine, sounds quite a chap
to do so well he was there from 1914 by 1920 he was still only 31years old.  I have to find what happened to him.

[ainslie]

The award of the MC to a warrant officer might well be mentioned in a regimental history or in a battalion's war diary. 
The museum at Fulwood Barracks may be able to help with this.  I hope you find your man in the 1911 census, which should clinch the facts.

[er indoors]

Thank's Ainslie yes it is him in 1911 no doubt so it is now down to war diary info or somewhere I can confirm his age or career with the regiment.

[jds1949]

The National Archives has copies of the War Diaries of the 2nd Battalion South Lancashire Regiment. They are in two parts and the references are:

WO 95/1414 [1914-1915]
WO 95/2250 [1915-1918]

Go to:

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/search/search_results.aspx?st=q&queryText=wo%2095%20south%20lancashire%20regiment&aqgQueryText=wo%2095%20south%20lancashire%20regiment&queryType=ALL

and if you click on the relevant links you will get a choice of how to obtain them. If you live anywhere near London then a trip to Kew is probably the best option.

jds1949