German Pork Butchers in Britain

[Bethgem]

Hello all you descendants of German pork butchers in Britain.
In May next year I’m giving a talk in Salzburg/Austria on the topic: Migration and food. For this I’m in need of some photos that show the shop fronts of German butchers with their windows and all the specialities and delicacies displayed in them. Is there anyone who owns such a photo and could send me a copy?

With kind regards
histres

Hello K-H, yes I have some photos and a bit of history you just might be able to use in your talk. I will have to get help from my hubby to load the photos onto my computer, soon. I am very proud of my grandfather, George Grün who had a shop in Congleton, Cheshire. I will send the photos in a pm soon.
Best wishes,
Bethgem

[Berlin-Bob]

the shop in Burnley is a prime example of the anti-German sentiments of that period..

Just as a general reminder that you may need to widen your search -
many germans changed their names due to anti-german sentiments before WW1:

In a similar vein:

I posted some tips on anglicization of emigrant names at
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,11860.0.html
"Sharing Useful Tips: Germany & E.Europe"

includes my favourite name-change of all time:
".. Abraham ben Isaiah, otherwise known as Moses Abraham Groomsfelt, or Jones, a silversmith .."

I also read an account recently, in a family history book, of two brothers Frank Charles DEGENHARDT and Walter DEGENHARDT, who, at the turn of the century, decided their names (their father was a german immigrant) were TOO german:

Walter DEGENHARDT became Walter HART, and
Frank Charles DEGENHARDT became Frank CHARLES  !!

Bob

[loouie]

What a fascinating discussion...

Just as a matter of interest there were Jewish butchers in Germany in the 1800's who dealt in pork. my Ggrandfather was one of them and the explanation is quite simple. Until the early 1800's jews in parts of what is now south west germany / Rhineland were confined to villages and not allowed to practice any trade - except for that of being a butcher (to provide kosher meat) . So there were butchers who had two seperate slaughter rooms, tools and practices, a kosher one and a non-kosher one.

When Jews were allowed to choose trades some of them remained butchers and in order to  remain competitive they would have to ( especially in germany ) deal in pork. Todays Beth Din ( those who oversee what is kosher) may not approve but that is another story.

From there its not a long jump to see how German skills in pork sausage making would have been popular in an industrialising Britian where people who had moved to towns couldn't spend hours standing over the fire preparing their own home gron pork products. German pork products whould have been the TV dinner equivalent of the day.

So there would have been a excellent business opportunity for anybody who was prepared to move to England.

Its harder to conceive how the name Kristian was Jewish but he could have changed that one as well. After all what was acdptable in rural germany may not have been acceptable in England if there were more religious jews from Eastern Europe about. So he may have found it convenient to call himself Kristian.

Just a wild theory of course...

[Bethgem]

 :)Hello loouie,
Yes this story has caused some interest, thank goodness!
Nice to hear another 'take' on the reason why they migrated. It could have been your example and also the political situation there at the time. I don't have the details to hand on that, but I read something about it somewhere.
My family tree on my Mother's side is of German farmers, going on for over 400 years! The keeping of pigs and the subsequent products from them seems to have been the only source of income for them, and your explanation of events must have had an influence on them keeping to that trade.

I never met or knew my Grandparents, or any of my many Aunties from that family. I have discovered all of them and their profession as Pork Butchers since tracing my family tree. I wish I had known all of them!

[johnbhoy]

Hi Loouie, we're glad your enjoying the thread, that is an interesting post you wrote, thanks for sharing it

Johnbhoy 

[amandacornwell]

Hello there
I am researching the same family - Christian Frederick Wall for a descendant of his son Roland Wall born 1915 in Carlise.
I have literally only just started looking and have found them in the census the same as you did John when you started.
Great to make contact. I tried to send you a message but it won't let me.
Amanda

[scrimnet]

Welcome to Rootschat Amanda!

I'm afraid that you have to make x3 posts before you can send a PM...

Enjoy!

[Bethgem]

Hello there
I am researching the same family - Christian Frederick Wall for a descendant of his son Roland Wall born 1915 in Carlise.
I have literally only just started looking and have found them in the census the same as you did John when you started.
Great to make contact. I tried to send you a message but it won't let me.
Amanda

Hello Amanda,
Welcome to this very helpful forum! You just have to reply and say something, anything, to make up the three qualifying posts required in order for you to be able to send a private message to anyone. So then, say hello and that will be ok! Hear you soon!

[amandacornwell]

 ; Hello and thanks for that tip