Author Topic: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.  (Read 111146 times)

Offline corisande

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Re: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.
« Reply #171 on: Thursday 21 April 11 09:43 BST (UK) »
Quote
From enquiries made by me, it was apparent that the shooting was not done by the I.R.A, but was obviously done by the British Forces What do make of that? 

I certainly do not believe that. Neither do I believe that the IRA shot the Lord Mayor of Cork  :) At least everyone agrees that Carew was in DBC Tea Rooms in Dame St when he was shot

Quote
He also mentions an encounter with Captain King and Captain Hardy,
Yes please can I have that, I have a lot on those two and it all helps
http://www.cairogang.com/escaped/hardy/hardy.html
http://www.cairogang.com/escaped/king/king.html

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Offline corisande

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Re: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.
« Reply #172 on: Thursday 21 April 11 11:12 BST (UK) »
With Shane's help I have located the DBC Tearooms. They were owned by the Dublin Bread Company  at 33 Dame Street in Dublin

It was quite a well known place in its time, it even features in one of James Joyces works. This is only 100 metres from the gates of Dublin Castle, between the Castle and College Green.

Are there any other WS where anyone claims to have taken a pot shot at Carew on this date. By guess is that there will not be, as unsuccessful shootings tend not to be recorded.
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Offline capel street man

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Re: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.
« Reply #173 on: Thursday 21 April 11 13:50 BST (UK) »
Michael Noyk, W.S.no.707, pages 31,32 ref King and Hardy Quote -
Shortly before Christmas of 1920, I was invited out to a birthday party of one of the children of Mr.William Sinclair whom I have mentioned in connection with the Cavan election.He lived in a house overlooking the Bailey Lighthouse in Howth. In the party was a Mrs. Salkeld, mother of Cecil Salkeld, the artist; the late Padraig O Conaire, the well known Irish writer, and Paul Farrell, the then actor and now a medical doctor. After we had had our meal we sat round the fire and somewhere about 9 o,clock there was a loud knock at the door, which was an unusual thing in that locality. Mr. Sinclair went out to answer the door and seemed to be a long time away. Suddenly a number of Auxiliaries came into the drawing - room where we were seated, headed by the notorious Captain King. He went over and opened a violin case, but he did not say anything which to me seemed very strange. However, I soon learned the reason. After about ten minutes, the door opened suddenly and in rushed a British Officer wearing a " British warmer". He did not walk across the room, but rushed in, the reason for which I guessed later. Without any ado, he pounced on Padraig O Conaire and seized him by the coat, asking him what his occupation was. Padraig said he was a writer and he then proceeded to search him and took out a small notebook which Padraig had, and, on the first page was written the name " Michael Collins". "Ow ", said this gentleman, who so far, had not disclosed his identity, " you know Michael Collins " ? " Oh no ", said Padraig, " that is the name of a dog". He then turned to Farrell and he asked him what he did. Farrell said, I am an actor, "Ow", continued the officer, can you recite Kevin Barry? You know, he added, " I am Captain Hardy". None of the others were aware of this "gentlemans " identity, but I happened to know that he was the head of the " Murder Gang", which did not make me feel too comfortable. He then turned to me and said, " what do you do ? "I summoned all the coolness I could command, knowing the reputation of this gentleman, replying, I am a solicitor. Again he said " Ow". Do you know Duggan, the solicitor. He has accused me of torturing Kevin Barry. " Oh, yes ", said I,"I know Duggan professionally, just as I know Sir Henry Wynne", who was the Chief Crown Solicitor. With that, Captain King turned round and said "I have arrested him twice already". "No", I said, " you have not arrested me twice - you are wrong". That evidently knocked him out. Hardy then turned round and pointing to O Conaire, said, "Come along with us".He took O Conaire out and a dead silence ensued in the room. One lady who was in the party began screaming, " they,ll murder Padraig " but I said keep quiet, I am certain they have not gone away yet. I was correct. They came back with Padraig after about twenty minutes, so we were all delighted to see him again. As Sinclair was preparing to pour out a glass of whiskey, in they came again, and again asked Padraig to come out. This time we were certain that " he was for it". However, after what appeared to be an interminable delay, Padraig came back. We all spent an uneasy night, especially myself, as I knew the identity of Hardy and could not communicate it to the others. I may mention that Hardy had a limp and, in order to disguise it, walked very quickly so that it might not be noticed. It would, of course, lead to his identification and, needless to say, he was very much sought after by Michael Collins, not exactly for "social reasons" un- quote.
Interesting, as it shows that those in the know feared these officers as they were experts in their own right, they were top of the list to be taken out but were always one step ahead of their counter parts, they must have had that sixth sense, that special quality that makes certain men stand out and survive in what was a very dirty war for both sides. I wonder what or whom they were after, its a long way out from Dublin Castle.
C.S.M

Offline corisande

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Re: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.
« Reply #174 on: Thursday 21 April 11 16:00 BST (UK) »
Thanks CPM, I have added that stuff to King and Hardy

King and Hardy were on raids most days, or indeed two or three. I don't think one can necessarily read too much into one raid, but they certainly were the main interrogators in Dublin Castle
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Offline gkenny

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Re: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.
« Reply #175 on: Friday 20 May 11 14:35 BST (UK) »
This might be of interest to some here. I have put online a small collection of documents, letters, photographs and postcards as well as a substantial scrapbook mostly put together during independence era Ireland.

It belonged to Vincent (Vinny) Byrne of the Irish Volunteers and Michael Collins' Squad :

http://www.militaria-archive.com/independence/vinny-byrne.html

Included in the documents are the following, which I believe may relate to Major Charles Milne Cholmeley Dowling shot by Michael Collins Squad at 28 Pembroke Street on Bloody Sunday, 21 November 1920. This is a guess based purely on the name and the fact it originates from Tom Keogh.





If anyone can clarify the backgroung to that document or add any information to any of the other items there please get in touch either by pm or via the email address link on the site.

*Please note the moderators do not need to remove the pictures for copyright reasons (as happened previously) as I own the site and materials and am posting here for educational /research reasons.

Offline capel street man

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Re: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.
« Reply #176 on: Sunday 22 May 11 11:59 BST (UK) »
Many thanks gKenny for posting that information and your website on Vinnie Byrne, its gives a great insight of the man and I look forward to looking through all the pictures and stories you have accumulated, my own grandfather and some of his brothers were members of "E" Co.2nd Battalion and would have known Vinny personally, in fact Vinny and members of the Old Dublin Brigade draped the flag and were guard of honour at my grandfathers funeral.
Are you related to Vinny ?
CSM

Offline gkenny

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Re: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.
« Reply #177 on: Sunday 22 May 11 13:26 BST (UK) »
Hello CSM man, no I am not related to Vinny Byrne at all.

If you can add any names to the people in the photographs or clarify any information in the  documents or scrapbok please let me know. I hope you find it as interesting as I have.

Offline capel street man

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Re: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.
« Reply #178 on: Sunday 12 June 11 08:29 BST (UK) »
Good morning Corisande, came across this report in the Birmingham Post ref - Bloody Sunday quote -

"At 38, Upper Mount Street, the assailants were a party of about twenty armed men, who entered when the door was opened by a servant, who was asked if Mr. Aime's was in. She replied " Yes" The raiders then visited the front room on the first floor, where Lieutenant Bennett was.They took himinto a back room, where Mr.Aime's slept. The servant heard shots, and after a little while, the men left. The servant then rushed downstairs, and saw the two men lying dead. She raised an alarm, and a military officer, who had been sleeping in the house, came downstairs." un-quote

I have never come across another officer staying in the house before, and if he was a Secret Service man, we will probably never find out who he was.

The I.R.A. didn't know he was there, likewise with Carew and his batman living directly opposite until they opened fire on the team making their escape.

I agree with what you say on your P.R.B. site, that these men didn't get into the news because they were good at their jobs and all credit is due to them on their cover, disguise and how they conducted themselves and not  become exposed to the enemy.it what was a "dirty war" for both sides.

From your own posts corisande, there seems to be a number of these Secret Service men that went undetected and slipped under the radar, and because they were Secret Service men, nobody knows the full story.

CSM

Offline corisande

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Re: Micheal Collins and 'The Squad'.
« Reply #179 on: Sunday 12 June 11 08:37 BST (UK) »
The problem I have is that Dublin at that time was full of British Officers and ex-British officers, most given no name for obvious reasons.. Viz Mrs W's book, it was difficult for them to get lodgings, so they did tend to congregate in houses that would accept them. It is virtually impossible to find out anything without a number of clues. Trouble is that even the "secret" Military Inquests have the names of the witnesses etched out, so that instead of a name it is just "Witness 1"

If you look at Bowen's press cuttings, Bowen shared his lodgings with another ex-RAF officer, but I have been unable to find out who it was, even though there is a lot more to go on there, given Bowen's immediate past service in Lithuania and Russia

What I am doing is just adding small clues as I get them and hope that one dau a fuller picture will emerge.
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