Custom House Burning - Part 1 / John Wilson

[seanod]

Not being a Dub, none of the place-names means much to me. I'll have to get a map out and study it carefully!

Gavdonnelly, I have looked through the box file but all I could find was the reference to T. Donnelly at the funeral of John Wilson and a mention of him as one of the guests at a Custom House Memorial ceremony in 1962 (May 27th, Irish Independent).

"The Parade which was led by the St. James's Brass and Reed Band was commanded by Mr V. Byrne, assisted by Mr. G. Greene, Chief Stewards were Messers P. Crean, T. Clarke, T. Donnelly, P. Mahon, and J. King. The attendance also included: Lieut-Gen. S McKeown, Chief of Staff; Major General S. Collins Powell, Adjutant General; Mr O Traynor, General R. Mulcahy and Senator M. Hayes."

Any or all of these men could have been present at the Custom House, but the only ones on my files so far are T. Donnelly (as of today), V. Byrne and O Traynor. I also note that T. Donnelly was a mourner at a number of Dublin Brigade funerals down the years, such as the funeral of R. O'Donohue in January 1938.

I'll check out some of the more obscure published sources again, anyway, and let you know the result.

[Gary Deering]

As a matter of interest Sean when did Vinnie Byrne leave the Army was it 1924 when the rest where made resign there comissions ?

[seanod]

I'm not sure about that one, Gary. I know the business you mean, though I can't remember what it was called in the history books. Was it the Curragh Crisis or was that another name for the revolt of British Army officers against Home Rule in 1913? A lot of the officers refused to be demobbed and were court-martialled for insubordination. I don't know if Vinnie Byrne was one of the people concerned. If I find anything to resolve that question I'll post it. 

[seanod]

This document in the link seems to contain a list of all the demobilised officers but you have to pay a tenner for it!

http://books.national-army-museum.ac.uk/staff-duties-appointments-discharges-memo-no-13-pr-25352.html

 

[Gavdonnelly]

The files that I got access to just gave a list of Thomas Donnelly's general activities during the war of independence and he only briefly mentioned taking part in the burning of the custom house. There is no actual detailed description of exactly what he did or all the people he was with.

On the issue of The Crisis as it became known. Cmdt Thomas Donnelly did resign in 1924 and I laughed when I seen his file because he scribbled out the reason the army put down for leaving 'Demobilisation' and wrote resigned above it!

I photographed all the documents I seen and I've recently got hold of another file relating to his pension from the Department of Defence in Galway. This was a great file because to get his pension he had to list his activities and give references and names of some people he fought beside. So here they are

Burning of Raheny Barracks
Burning of Dollymount Coastguard Station
Ambushes in North Strand, Whitehall and Ballybough Road
Attack on L.N.W.P. hotel
Raids for arms at Killester and Artane
Attack at Town Hall, Clontarf(I did find some extra info on this and it seem the volunteers threw grenades at the Auxiliary men and exchanged fire. one civilian died)
Burning of the Custom House

The one job he did give details on was when he was unofficially sent by his O/C Frank Henderson to london with Thomas Nolan to procure revolvers. This mission took place during the truce and was sanctioned in case the treaty negotiations broke down. He was helped by his wife's cousin Thomas Deegan to get the 15 revolvers they stole through customs in Holyhead. Thomas Deegan and Thomas Donnelly both worked on the RMS Leinster and Mr Deegan obviously new the people to get them safely back to Dublin. Thomas Donnelly also mentioned in his letter to the pension board that he met Sam Maguire in London and that he could verify the story.

I have all the names he mentioned that he worked with in the F Company 2 Battalion during the war of independence if you like. I can't confirm if they were at the custom house but it's a possibility.

on a side issue, Thomas Deegan and Thomas Donnelly were on the RMS leinster when it was torpedoed by the germans in 1918 killing five hundred people and I found a book online 'Torpedoed - The RMS leinster disaster' which has an interview with Thomas Deegan on his experience on the boat when the disaster happened.

[Gavdonnelly]

The names that he gave in the file that were part of the F Coy 2nd Battalion are as follows.

O/C Frank Henderson and Oscar Traynor
Col Cmdt T. Kilcoyne
Cmdt Charles McCabe
Colonel Charlie Dalton
Capt J. Ward
Capt Thomas Nolan
Lt P. Fleming
O/C of Irregulars Patrick Sweeney

Not sure if J. Ward is Sean Ward because I found two references in his file, one from each so it looks like the might be different people.

There is one source of information that I am going to try to get my hands on and that is a book written in 1929 by Charlie Dalton 'With the Dublin Brigade 1917-1921. This guy was mentioned quite a bit in my great grandfathers files and it seem he was quite close to the Donnelly family at that time. It's a rare book and hopefully I will get my hands on it because it should give me a very good idea of what life was like during the war of independence with the f company 2nd Battalion. It might also be of interest to you because he might give a detailed description of the Custom house and the men that were there.

He became a very important man during the civil war because I think he became one of the top men on the republican side during the civil war.

[Gavdonnelly]

'The Crisis' in 1924 came about because when the Free State government tried to demobolise some of the men a huge argument broke out over the men that were to go.

Following the signing of the treaty in 1922 some of the RIC men that fought against the volunteers went straight into the new Free State Army and worked alongside the volunteers that stayed loyal to Michael Collins. The problem in 1924 was that some of the men the Free State goverment wanted to demobolise were originally volunteers during the war of independence and some of the RIC men were to be kept on so to speak. This caused enormous trouble in the army and very nearly resulted in another war. The result of the crisis was that many volunteers from the war of independence resigned their post in the Free State Army in protest of how the demobilisation was handled.

I know my great grandfathers wife was very active for the Cumman na mban during the war of independence and I found out that when she died in 1937, the goverment wanted to give her an army funeral but Thomas Donnelly refused. So obviously the crisis left a bitter taste in his mouth and must have done for a lot of the volunteers that stayed loyal to Michael Collins following the sigining of the Treaty.

[seanod]

All this is fascinating. Thanks very much for your input, Gavdonnelly.  Some of the names you gave were definitely there at the Custom House - Tom Kilcoyne was there, and so was Patrick Fleming. I found some more information about Seán Ward. He is listed as John Ward in the newspaper accounts of casualties just after the burning. It is almost certainly the same man because he is given as a merchant tailor, and later on he was described as a master tailor. He had a brother called Nicholas Ward who was also in F Company but I don't know if he was at the CH.

I can't remember if I've seen the Dalton book or not. Have you got the book "Dublin's Fighting Story?" It goes into a lot of the major events and actions. Keep your eye on this strand, because if I come across any information in the witness statements relating to Tom Donnelly I'll post it here.

[Gary Deering]

Just on the Crisis, there was another side to this, My Granfather William Deering was a British Soldier, he joined the Freestate Army straight after leaving the British Army (so no IRA connection as I was told) he had a very early early number V0005**. My father only found this out yesterday thanks to the Army.Now he left the Army in 1933 & the family told me he hated Dev with a passion.So what I am thinking is, that the lads that did stay got out when Dev came to power as they could not stomach serving with the other side.There is also a story I heard ( that my Granfather told)that they,the Freestate soldiers used to leave Devs cell door open hoping he would try & escape to they had a reason to shot him.