1851 Lookup - Lambeth and/or Southwark

[Caswell]

I'd be really grateful for a look up in 1851 for the family listed below who were living in  St George Southwark in 1861 but judging by the place of birth given for the children would have been living  in Lambeth in 1851.

For background info I am searching for a Charles CROCK born circa 1844 in Southwark whose father was called Joseph CROCK and was a hatter.  I've been unable to trace Charles back any further than 1874 when he was living in Lancashire.  I know I may be  clutching at straws with the COCK family below but the Charles is the right age, he is living at the place known to have been the birthplace of my Charles and his father is a hatter!  At the moment it's the best lead I've had on Charles CROCK for years.  I cannot even begin to describe the trouble this ancestor has given me!

I've been unable to find any of this family listed below in the 1871 census which leads me to believe that possibly the name has been mis transcribed and that they were not called COCK.  However if I can find them in the 1851 census it will be of great help in trying to establish whether or not this family may be the family of my Charles CROCK. 


Here is the info from 1861:

RG09 Piece 333 Folio 71 Page 40 - 1 Mount Place, St George Southwark


COCK, John, Head, Married, 50, Hatter, Born Cornwall
COCK, Elizabeth, Wife, Married, 47, Hatter Wife, Born Cornwall
COCK Elizabeth, Daughter, Unmarried, 30, Cook, Born Guildford Surrey
COCK William, Son, Unmarried, 28, Brass Moulder, Born Lambeth, Surrey
COCK, Eliza, Daughter, Unmarried, 21, Servant, Born Lambeth Surrey
COCK John, Son, Unmarried, 19 Pastry Cook, Born Lambeth Surrey
COCK Charles, Son 15, Scholar, Born Lambeth Surrey
COCK Mary, Daughter, 10, Scholar, Born Lambeth Surrey
COCK, Richard, Son 8, Scholar, Born Lambeth Surrey
COCK Maria, Daughter, 5, Born Lambeth Surrey
COCK Isabella, Dauther, 3 Born Lambeth Surrey


Thank you in advance to anyone who can help.  And if anyone has any ideas on what I can try next I'd be very happy to hear then.

Caro   

[Reyz]

Hi
I checked 1 Mount Place in 1851 and your family are not there then.  However the address came under the Borough of Lambeth if that helps?

Checked on the name index under Cock Cook Crock etc and not on there yet.
Perhaps the East Surrey Family History Society has some indexes that could help? Think they cover that area.

Good luck
Reyz

[Caswell]

Thanks for that Reyz.  I don't know if this is the family I am looking for but a the moment it's pretty much the only lead I have.  I shall have another go at tracking the family found in 1861 forwards, so far I haven't been able to find them - but it's a large family so at least some of them must be out there!

Thanks again

Caro

[Biker]

Hello

It's been a while on this one, but wondering if you're still looking for Mr Cock/Crock?

Have you found anything to identify the family further or confirm your 1861 is correct?

Regards
Jonathan

[Caswell]

Hi Jonathan

I am still looking.... I managed to rule out the 1861 Cock family though.

I tried a sideways move and I've managed to make contact with descendants of the eldest son of Charles Crock (who was also called Charles Crock).  It was through Roots Chat that I achieved this as Charles Crock Junior emigrated to South Africa circa 1910.  I left a message on the South Africa board and a roots chatter in South Africa recognised the name Crock and made a telephone call to some people by that name in Johannesburg and put me in touch with some distant cousins.  Through them I have learned that it's probable that Charles Crock was not born with the name Crock.  Unfortunately none of them know when, or why he changed his name... nor do they know what he changed it from.  His original name might have been "Hartley or Hatch or something like that". 


The possible name change is not really surprising as it explains why I've been unable to find him prior to the 1881 census (although he was definitely calling himself Crock from at least 1875 when his first child was born).  It might well also explain why he and his wife Sarah didn't actually marry until after the births of 6 of their 7 children - despite the fact that Sarah was calling herself by the name Crock (she appears on the 1881 census as Crock and registers the births of her children under the name Crock, formerly Gray).  I suspect that Charles changed his name to avoid being found, maybe by a wife he abandoned or maybe because of something else.

Incidently I have their original marriage certificate, the one handed to them at the time of their marriage and it has been falsified - they changed the year and their ages to make it look like they married 10 years before they actually did..... at least I presume it was them that made the alterations, although realistically it could have been their son (my great grandfather) or one of his siblings that altered it in an attempt to disguise the fact that his/her parents married somewhat late!

Still, never give up.... I've only been looking for him for just over 20 years... early days yet ;-)

Regards

Caroline