Hartley connections

[Cajondy]

I wonder if anyone can help me with this one...

I am trying to find the connection between Joseph Hartley (born c1860, Married Mary Gainford (born 1879) in 1901 @ the church of St Catherine in Eskdalde) and Hannah Hartley (born c1894) to George Nicholson Simpson Porter (born c1897) in 1924 @ the Presbyterian Church in Liverpool

On Josephs marraige certificate he was living at Esk View at the time of the marraige and his father was Isaac Hartley, a farmer (Eskdale area)

On Hannah's marraige certificate she was living at "The Manor", Beech St, Liverpool and her father was Robert Hartley - a timber merchant (I beleive, according to CEnsus information he was from Egremont, CUmberland)

I've searched the census records for both Isaac Hartley (born c1830)  - who I believe is the son of Isaac (born c 1782)m and further research suggests that Isaac born c 1782 is the son of Thomas (born c1752) and he's the son of Jonathon (born c1719).... This line of HArtley's came from Eskdale area
 
I've also searched census for Robert - and I think he married Mary Ellen Lennox in 1884. Their marraige certificate shows Roberts father as being Abraham Hartley (also a timber merchant)..... The census then suggests that Abraham (born c 1837) was the son of Abraham (born c1805) who I think was the son of Henry. This line of Hartley's came from Egremont area
Can anyone help me find where the connection is please

thanks allot
Anne

[emmsthheight]

Hi Anne

Maybe I'm being a bit slow here.  I know that Hartley is a name particularly prevalent in the Eskdale area and also Egremont, and that there's a good chance of a connection, possibly distant between many of them.

But is there a specific reason that you think these two should have a connection?  Do they appear on a will or similar?

I'm thinking, but I'm not sure which direcetion to go in.

Best wishes

Emms

[Cajondy]

Hi Emma
thanks for the reply...
The honest answer is - I'm not honestly sure what the connection is - but my mother (who's great aunt was Mary Gaindford - married to joseph HArtley, recalls her mother talking of a Hannah Hartley that married a George Nicholson Simpson Porter (from Eskdale)...
I've got marriage certificates of both unions, and also marriage certificates of both respective Hartley parents....

My mother seemd to recall there being some connection - but neither she nor I could confirm what it was..

The interesting link (now) is that my mother is a close friend of George nicholson Simpson Porters late son's wife (He was George HArtley Porter) and so the interest in finding out the connection

As you rightly say - there were a great number of the Hartley's in the Eskdale and the Egremont areas - lots of common names (Hannah being one of them - indeed, MAry and Joseph had a daughter HAnnah)

Any help much appreciated
thanks for taking the time
kind regards
Anne

[emmsthheight]

Hi Anne

Thank you for getting back to us.

I'll have a good look at that.

Best wishes

Emms

[Cajondy]

thank you Emma
any help appreciated.....
Anne

[S.Hartley]

Hello,
Joseph Hartley and Mary Gainford were my great grandparents.
I've researched my family tree on the Hartley side in Eskdale back to 1578 ( The Percy Survey).
During the 1800s we had a very strong connection with Liverpool. Mary Gainford's parents, Harrison Gainford and Hannah Russell were married in Kirkdale, Liverpool on 11th March 1876, even though both were born and bred in Eskdale? Hannah's address on the Mar Cert says Walton, Liverpool.
Hannah Russell's father Jeremiah Russell was born,raised,lived and died in Eskdale. But his other 2 daughters Ellen and Mary both died in Liverpool and were interred with him in St Catherines in Eskdale.
The 1861 census records show Russells born in Eskdale and living in Liverpool, also Russells born in Liverpool and living in Eskdale...very confusing ??.

 Iam told that Joseph Porter Tyson ( Joseph Hartleys grandfather..my Gr.Gr.Grandfather) inherited a small fortune c.1860  from John Tyson who owned an import warehouse in Liverpool.

Iam also told that Harrison Gainford travelled to Liverpool twice to raise funds to buy a field in Eskdale from a Hartley, when he married was he mixing business with pleasure??
I'm still wondering why a small remote Cumbrian farming valley had such a strong connection with Liverpool.
It seems to me that the Tysons of Eskdale were the 1st to show up in Liverpool. (The Hartleys and Tysons are connected by several  marriages back to 1578)

There was the famous Hartleys of Colne, Lancashire who set up their Jam factory in Liverpool, and even created Hartley Village (still there today) but I've not found a connection to the Eskdale Hartleys...?

I'd also appreciate any info on this connection.

Stu

[emmsthheight]

Hi Stu

Sounds lke an imexciting connection between your families! 

Meantime, as far as Liverpool is concerned, it's not so odd for one Tyson or Hartley, it's that the coonection was so common for so many families especially from this area!

Ar one time Whitehaven was the third largest port in England after Liverpool.

If you dreamed of being big in business or making a fortune, or seeing the world, the post was a good place to go, with so much business generated by the large number of people coming in to the town aand also passing through for a ship to Liverpool and hence emigration.

Goods were also needed both to equip and maintain the ships and also for cargoes to trade with other countries.  If you wanted to go further afield, or expand business into export, it was, Whitehaven, to Liverpool and the world.

Also because of the costal trade, loads of local families married into Liverpool families and vivi verci aand indeed families especially from ports all over the country.  If you look at the cendud, there are loads offamilies in Liverpool and Cumberland which have chi;ldren born in Liverpool and others in Cumberland.

Eskdale is a little way out, if they wanted to trade they travelled and also the population was moving out of agriculture and towards the laeger towns..

If you're lucky you maybe able to trace some of your family in trade or via the passenger lists travelling.

Good luck!

Keep us posted with what you find and there may beother records which will help.

Best wishes

Emms

[emmsthheight]

PS Anne, I notice you mentionrd a timber merchant.  Timber was big business - both for shipping and also international trade in fine woods such as mahogany for furniture.

Emms

[Godmershamgurl]

Hi I am of the Hartley line from eskdale. I hope I can help you piece together what your looking for.