This is becoming an obsession - sorry

[ivanidea]

Yes. I saw the 1871 Mahon Census for Dennis, Bridget and family and wondered!

Could be the same family group or, of course, could be a red herring!

Even so it still leaves the Catherine Jennings/Dennis Mahon marriage to "sort out"!

Ivan

[heywood]

You're so right and all this also hinges on whether Herbert Callister born Manchester is Herbert Jennings/Stockton living in Tyldesley. So the two places are involved somehow  and of course we have to link the name Callister 

Back for another trawl around the censuses

[ivanidea]

.

[Barbara.H]

Do you know if the address on the birth certificate is a home for unmarried mothers or similar or a private address?
I was wondering if she was perhaps sent away from home to have the child as Manchester is a few miles from Tyldesley.
heywood

I found 7 Brighton Ave (see the original post) on the 1881, and it was occupied by a family called Firkins.  It appeara to be a private residence.
RG11/3906/65 Page 42

There is an Elizabeth Ann Firkins among them, age 26, 'born St Helena,  Africa'  She is listed as married but there is no obvious spouse, so hard to tell whether Firkins is her married or maiden name.
Might be worth casting around for a Firkins/Callister connection?  Yet another 'just a thought'!

Another thought is that, is Herbert was born in Manchester but then was taken somewhere else straight afterwards, he might not have known that he was born there.  So I would have another look at the non-Manchester Herberts, if nothing else shows up.

  Barbara

[will-o-wisp]

following Emms thought and Herberts later connection with Tyldesley - there is a Herbert Jennings b. 1883 who is a visitor on the 1891  census at Alfred Street, Tydesley. Jackie

Well, I am glad you have found this one too.  I suspect he became Herbert Stockton on the 1901 census listed as "Cousin" to Kate/Catherine Stockton.   It is a while since I tried to track him, but seem to remember I couldn`t find a suitable birth for a Herbert Jennings or Stockton. 

Regards.
Mo

Mo you could possibly have done it for me - my mother (now aged 96 and suffering from alzheimers so unable to assist any more) used to insist that Herbert was fostered by a family called 'Stockton' - i will try this route.

will-0-wisp

[will-o-wisp]

Mo

I could kiss you - and all you other wonderful people who have tried to help.  I always understood grandad lived 'down the Jig' which is an area of Tyldesley - the addresses on the 1901 census and the 1891 census are both Jig addresses - I think I've finally cracked it!
Thank you all so much

will-o-wisp

[heywood]

Do you know if the address on the birth certificate is a home for unmarried mothers or similar or a private address?
I was wondering if she was perhaps sent away from home to have the child as Manchester is a few miles from Tyldesley.
heywood

I found 7 Brighton Ave (see the original post) on the 1881, and it was occupied by a family called Firkins.  It appeara to be a private residence.
RG11/3906/65 Page 42

There is an Elizabeth Ann Firkins among them, age 26, 'born St Helena,  Africa'  She is listed as married but there is no obvious spouse, so hard to tell whether Firkins is her married or maiden name.
Might be worth casting around for a Firkins/Callister connection?  Yet another 'just a thought'!

Another thought is that, is Herbert was born in Manchester but then was taken somewhere else straight afterwards, he might not have known that he was born there.  So I would have another look at the non-Manchester Herberts, if nothing else shows up.

  Barbara

Interesting:
1871 Census Scotland

Elizabeth Ann Firkins b 1854 St Helens Lancashire

She is a pupil at a Girls Reformatory, Old Machar, Aberdeenshire !

There is a birth for her in Prescot district 1854 and a marriage in 1875 Chorlton (Manchester) district to either Walter Bennett or Samuel Griggs.

well... I'm having a think!

Lancashire BMD has the marriage- it is to Walter Bennett

I thought we were getting closer - 1891 -the Firkins have a grandson living with them surname McAuley but found another daughter married a Mr McAuley (was thinking that McCallister may sounds like McAuley- grasping at straws  )

[heywood]

just thought to check and the Firkins (mum, dad and grandchild) are not living in same street in 1891.
Thomas Firkins is from Worcestershire originally and Mary Firkins from Wales so at the moment can't make any connection with Stocktons.

It's becoming more pear-shaped 

1881  RG11; Piece: 3767; Folio: 130; Page: 47
there is a Walter and Elizabeth Ann Bennettt living Wigan. He is a policeman and she is born St Helens 1855 (as is Elizabeth Ann Firkins who is living in manchester at same time!)
They have a son born 1876 Manchester 

(Unless she was entered twice on census - can there be two Elizabeth Ann Firkins?)

1891 the family are in Ashton u Lyne with more boys. The next son after Thomas is Albert born 1883  so this can't be the mother of Herbert Callister 

[will-o-wisp]

I think it is quite safe to post this as a look up completed - although I can understand why Herbert Callister appears as Herbert Stockton on the 1901 census I am at a loss as to why he is using the name Jennings on the 1891 census.  However I am convinced that both these Herberts are 'my Herbert' and as Herbert was illegitimate, left home when my father was quite young and 'dissappeared' until I managed to trace his I think I have discovered more than I could ever have hoped for.

So thank you everyone who has helped.

Will-o-Wisp