Mary Lawson (b.1806) Avondale

[Bathonian]

Just a point that I left out, I only had 9 children listed. The last one was Hugh, b.1840, so the names and dates would be appreciated.
Thanks again

Ken

[Lanark55]

Hi there, Children in date order:
Mary (1824), Grace (1825), William (1827), Maggie (1830), Thomas (1832), Gavin (1834), James (1836), Annie (1837), Hugh (1839), Helen (1842), Marion (1844) and Janet (1846).

Their parents and grandparents ( Mary Hay) are all buried in a Netherhall plot at St. Bride's Churchyard at Douglas, Lanarkshire. The family stone is a bit weathered to say the least but the first to names are legible. Janet Scott who married a local farmer at Douglas is also buried at St. Bride's.

LWR.

[Bathonian]

Many thanks for the list. In the 1841 census, there was also an Elizabeth, b.1829, also in the SP Grace was baptised as Grissell, b.6 Mar 1825. Did you have the date of death for Mary Hay? Her husband was William Scott, he was born in Douglas in 1770. I don't suppose you have any information on Mary Lawson's parents, James and Mary (nee Armstrong), the only marriage I can find took place in Glasgow in 1797?

Regards

Ken

[Lanark55]

Reply:
Mary Hay died 4 October 1839 according to the grave stone aged 73. (Douglas)
Grace Scott married a farmer from Selkirk.
According to my family tree, Mary Lawson was born 6 February 1794 to Gavin Lawson and Margaret Semple. They were from Lesmahagow Parish and married in March 1793. With the Scotts having a son Gavin ( born 1834) there is a strong possibilty the aforementioned were the grandparents.
Again, my tree did not have an Elizabeth but after some delving I can confirm she did exist and was married to a William Russell. She died in November 1886. Ironically she died at Ponfeigh Place Farm, Ponfeigh which was the home of her youngest sister Janet (Weir) and my great, great grandmother. As a child I lived a quarter of a mile from this farm.

[Ticadeau]

Hello.  I descend from Elizabeth, daughter of William Scott and Mary Hay.   The Tweeddale relationship is new to me.  However, my son and I left yellow roses at Canongate Church  two years ago on the anniversary of their marriage.  I live near DC and would be very happy for precise location of the burial place at St. Brides.  A picture of the stone would be a wonderful addition to my research and intended return to Scotland.  I am not familiar with your geography and am therefore  wondering about the Netherhall farm.  I visited Netherton Farm, Auchenheath Lanarkshire when I was 26.  Somehow, I associated it with Willliam Scott and Mary Hay.  Bill Carrouthers and family were farming there at the time.  Their son, Douglas may be farming there now.  Any pictures would be appreciated.  Elizabeth married Hugh Kirkland.    Would enjoy hearing from you.
                                  Shirley

[Lanark55]

The Scott family does get around. If you were not aware of the Tweeddale connection, then you will not be aware all descendants of Mary Hay are descended from Edward III of England. When Mary Hay married William Scott of Douglas, it cannot have been easy to be a tenanted farmer's wife when you were the grand daughter of both a Lord and a Baronet. Love must have conquered all!!!
Yes I have photographs of the Scott gravestone at Old St. Brides at Douglas. The grave is very close the family mausoleum of the Douglas family.
I notice you visited Netherton Farm. The Carruthers family no longer farm there. I see Douglas Carruthers once a month. I have never told him we are very distantly related. I have a copy of a 1970 family tree of Bess Kirkland and her husband. I knew as a child a Prof. Kirkland who lived in Lanark. I was told we were related.
Netherhall Farm at one time was on the estate of the Earl of Home and is situated near the Douglas Water and about 5 miles from my home town of the Royal burgh Of Lanark.   LWR.

[Ticadeau]

The reason I did not know of the Tweeddale connection is interesting in itself.  My grandmother, 9th daughter of William Kirkland and Isobel McColl, was named Mary Hay Kirkland.  Their Dairy farm is located under Louden Hill in Darvel.  Today it is called Underlaw.  My grandmother left Scotland in the early 1900's to come to America to marry my grandfather,  William Scott, who was the miller at Craigmill in Strathaven.  Like her name sake, she was disowned for marrying beneath her class and none of the siblings were allowed to write to her.  She died of Typhoid months after my mother was born.     When Elizabeth (Bess) Kirkland Kelly died, she left some money to my mother.  Somehow it found its way to my mother after many changes of addresses.  My mother communicated occasionally through Isabella Carrouthers who I assume is Bill's mother.  She was the last living person who had known my grandmother but died two months before I was able to get my mother to Scotland to meet her.  Douglas was a wee boy at the time...1966.

Someone in Australia of my McColl family from the 1700s actually found my mother's family in Australia and it was there I learned of the Tweeddale connection.
I was departing for Scotland in two weeks and altered my itinerary to include a 15 minute look in Duns Castle.  I told my son I would pay if he would make reservations, carry my bags, drive, handle the money a go where I wanted to go.  I had found about 9 places where the family had lived.  It was a trip that garnered me a hug when we returned home.

It was a Sinclare genealogist in Aberdeen who put it all together for me.  Did you know William Hay had a previous marriage to an Elizabeth Turnbull daughter of James Turnbull, a stocking weaver in Edinburgh?  His son William and Elizabeth of that marriage tried to inherit his estate.  They, however, had been removed from the records and Spott and Lawfield went to Robert.

Having grown up on the Colorado range, I am more used to cowboy and Indian wars and am struggling to understand your kings and queens.  I shall now have to read up on Edward III!  My son also came out a DNA match to the O'Neil Kings which it is said if your name is still O'Neil, you are most likely a legitimate descendant.  My x husband believed he was a king and has the name O'Neil.  That is why I use my grandfather Scott's name.  I can't tell you how much I loved Grandpa Scott.  I wanted the name of somebody who had loved me.

My e-mail is (*) should you like to communicate directly.  You have much to teach me.  How are we related and how are we related to Edward III.
Is Netherhall the farm where Mary Hay and William lived?  How did Elizabeth Kirkland end up living at Netherton farm?  I have a picture of her, I believe, Grandpa Kirkland, my grandmother and Archibald Kirkland at his wedding. 

Look so forward to hearing from you.

                    Shirley Scott

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[Bathonian]

The only marriage I was able to find on the SP for a William Scott and Mary Hay was on 7 Jan 1801 at Canongate, Edinburgh City. But I've been unable to find the birth or baptism of Mary to confirm her parents. So does anyone have any information on them and hence the line backwards? It would be great to see the line to the marquis of Tweeddale, and even better to see a line to Edward III.
Regards

Ken

[Ticadeau]

LWR
You are a treasure trove of information.  I am just learning to use this site and yesterday's note timed out.  I perhaps had too many  questions.  If you are familiar with Netherton Farm, and Elizabeth Kirkland Kelly, are you related to her?  My grandmother, Mary Hay Kirkland, the youngest daughter, was also disowned for marrying William Scott, miller at Craigmill in Strathaven.  Elizabeth Kirkland left some money for my mother when she died.  Bella Carrouthers saw that my mother received it after many years of address changes. 

A child of the Colorado prairie, I am more familiar with wars between cowboys and indians.  How are we related to Edward III?  William Hay's wife was Elizabeth Sinclare descendants of Sir John Sinclare and Robert Sinclare  which  can be traced to Viking royalty.  They lived at Stevenson in Dunbar.  William had a previous marriage to Elizabeth Turnbull whose father was James Turnbull, stocking weaver in Edinburgh.  They had two children, William and Elizabeth.  On William's death, they tried to inherit the estates of Spott and Lawfield but they had been erased from the records and the estates went to Robert, oldest son of William and Elizabeth Sinclare. 

Please teach me anything!

                                  Sincerely,
                                                  Shirley