Cutler family from Portsmouth to Shoreditch - please help

[jmec73]

Hi,

This is my first posting here, so I hope I'm not misusing this in anyway.

I've traced my Great-Great-Great Grandfather who was born in Shoreditch, Middlesex c.1823 but have been unable to find any details of his parentage or preceding family other than his own wife and children. So any help with parish registers lookups (I don't know which Church he would have been baptised in I'm afraid) or other hints would be much appreciated.

What I know so far is:

James Henry Cutler, b. c1823, d. c1891, married to Mary Cutler also born about 1823. James was born in Shoreditch, and in the 1881 census was living in Camberwell with 3 children: Alfred S Cutler (b. c1859); Albert F Cutler (b. c1863); Annie Cutler (b. c1866).

Alfred S Cutler (my Great-Great Grandfather) was married to Annie S Frith (c.1862-1919) and they had three children: Mabel F Cutler (b. c1887); Alfred V Cutler (b. c1891); and Albert Walter Cutler (b. c1892/3 and d. 1981). Albert Walter Cutler was my Great Grandfather.

I hope someone may be able to help. Many thanks in advance.

Jon.

[Valda]

Hi Jon

So taking them back census by census you immediately gain two older siblings

1871 census RG10 638 folio 5
13 Earl Road Bermondsey
James H Cutler 48 Head Married Hatter Shoreditch Middlesex
Mary Cutler 48 Wife Married Gloucestershire
Louisa Cutler 20 Daughter Bristol Gloucestershire
George Cutler 17 Son Southwark Surrey
Alfred Cutler 11 Son Bermondsey Surrey
Albert Cutler 8 Son Bermondsey Surrey
Anne Cutlerer 5 Daughter Bermondsey Surrey


Regards

Valda

[Mum44]

Hello Jon  

Welcome to Rootschat  

I haven't found James baptism,  however, do you have details of the family on earlier censuses ?  It seems Alfred had 6 older brothers and sisters.  Would you like earlier census details ?

I think James Henry and Mary were married in 1846 in Kensington;  do you have Alfred's birth certificate giving Mary's maiden name ?

ADDED :  Sorry Valda     Didn't see you there til I'd pressed send 

[Valda]

Hi Jon and Mum44

The family is easier to find in 1851 than in 1861.

1851 census HO107 1547 folio 340
8 Grove Street St George in the East
James Hy Cutler 28 Head Married Journeyman Hatter Shoreditch Middlesex
Mary Cutler 28 Wife Married Gloucestershire
Fredrick Henry Cutler 3 Son Bermondsey Surrey
Eliza Emily Cutler 2 Daughter Clifton Bristol
Maria Louisa Cutler 2 Daughter St Paul Bristol


Regards

Valda

[Valda]

At last the 1861 census

1861 census RG9 284 folio 93
17 Stepney Roadway Stepney
James H Cutler 38 Head Married Shopman Southwark Surrey
Mary Cutler 38 Wife Married Southwark Surrey
Frederick Cutler 13 Son Southwark Surrey 
Eliza Cutler 12 Daughter Southwark Surrey
Louisa Cutler 10 Daughter Southwark Surrey
George Cutler 8 Son Southwark Surrey
Thomas Cutler 5 Son Southwark Surrey 
Alfred Cutler 2 Son Southwark Surrey


Regards

Valda

[Mum44]

The marriage I found :

James Henry Cutler  Q3. 1846  Kensington  Vol. 3  Pg. 256

There is a Mary Knight on the page, and also a Mary Ann Godbold

I have found birth registrations for all the children except Thomas 

[Valda]

I'm wondering whether this is James Henry in 1841

1841 census HO107 1049/2 folio 29
Grange Walk Bermondsey
James Cutler 55 Mattress?? maker not born Surrey
James Cutler 15 Lab not born Surrey 
Sarah Cutler 50 Not born Surrey 
Elizth Cutler 25 Not born Surrey 
Martha Cutler 20 Not born Surrey 
Lucy Cutler 20 Not born Surrey
Caroline Cutler 20 Not born Surrey   
Jane Cutler 15 born Surrey
George Cutler 10 Born Surrey 
Thos Cutler 8 Born Surrey

Adult ages, those over 15, usually rounded down to the nearest 5 on the 1841 census.

1851 census HO107 1552 folio 331
9 Upper Story Street North Stepney
Sarah Cutler 62  Head Widow Annuitant Bethnal Green Middlesex
Martha Cutler 21 Daughter Cloth Cap maker Bermindsey Surrey
George Cutler 21 Son Colour Maker Bermondsey Surrey 
Thomas Cutler 19 Son Clerk Bermondsey Surrey

Possibel death registration of James senior.

Deaths Mar 1847 
Cutler  James     Bermondsey  4 26

For this to be the right family (and you will need to obtain a copy of James Henry's marriage certificate to help confirm his father's name and occupation) then this baptism of James Henry must be an adult baptism, though the index doesn't specify this. Given Sarah's age on both censuses that is a possibility. The other three Bermondsey baptisms are also of siblings of various ages at the time of baptism.

Any of these baptisms in the parish register itself would give James senior's occupation


JAMES HENRY CUTLER 
Christening:  20 MAY 1842   Saint Mary Magdalene, Bermondsey, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER 
Mother:  SARAH 

JANE CUTLER
Christening:  28 JUN 1837   Saint Mary Magdalene, Bermondsey, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER 
Mother:  SARAH 

GEORGE CUTLER
Christening:  28 JUN 1837   Saint Mary Magdalene, Bermondsey, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER
Mother:  SARAH 

THOS. WILLM CUTLER
Christening:  28 JUN 1837   Saint Mary Magdalene, Bermondsey, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER 
Mother:  SARAH 

This seems like most of the other older children except Caroline. Not all the children may have survived childhood.


SARAH LUCY CUTLER
Birth:  04 MAR 1809   
Christening:  21 MAY 1809   Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER 
Mother:  SARAH 

LUCY ANN CUTLER
Birth:  06 JAN 1811   
Christening:  28 JUL 1811   Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER 
Mother:  SARAH 

MARY ANN CUTLER
Birth:  12 DEC 1812   
Christening:  25 JUL 1813   Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER 
Mother:  SARAH 

ELIZABETH CUTLER
Birth:  08 NOV 1814   
Christening:  04 JUN 1815   Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER 
Mother:  SARAH 

MARTHA CUTLER
Birth:  18 MAY 1816   
Christening:  21 JUL 1816   Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER
Mother:  SARAH 

LUCY CATHERINE CUTLER
Birth:  01 JUN 1818   
Christening:  21 JUN 1818   Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
Father:  JAMES CUTLER
Mother:  SARAH 


There is a James Cutler and Sarah Stevens marriage in Islington in 1807. That might be them or it might not - James Cutler isn’t a rare name so it is only a possibility until proven correct.


I haven’t got a clue though where Portsmouth comes into all this though?



Regards

Valda

[jmec73]

Hi,

Thank you so much for such a quick and comprehensive response. I'm genuinely blown away by your help, really great!

Also, v interesting to see that he's acquired 3 more siblings! Unfortunately I don't have Mary's maiden name. I'll have a look at what I know already and what you've supplied to see how it all shapes up - should keep me busy!

BTW, the Portsmouth link is that Albert Walter Cutler lived in Portsmouth (Cosham) when I was a child and to his death and was married to Florence Cutler (nee Clarke). They were married near Chichester. Interestingly she married his slightly older brother first (Alfred I guess) but he was killed at the Somme in WWI, and they then married in 1919.

Thanks again, and also for anything else you might find.

Jon.

[Valda]

The marriage certificate (or one of the birth certificates of James Henry's children to confirm Mary's maiden name) and then the marriage certificate would confirm who James Henry's father was and what his occupation was. The censuses merely give possibilities of James Henry's siblings and parents.


1861 census RG9 285 folio 66
35 Bromley Street Stepney
Sarah Cutler 72 Head Widow Pensioner of Grocers Co. Bethnal Green Middlesex
Martha Cutler 44 Daughter Unmarried Cloth cap maker Shoreditch Middlesex
George Cutler 30 Head Married Oil colour maker Bermondsey Surrey
Elizabeth Cutler 22 Wife Married Staffordshire
George Jason Cutler 1 Son Stepney Middlesex


In which case James senior was unlikely to be a mattress?? maker on the 1841 census - but it is difficult to read what it says.

1871 census RG10563 folio  6
117 Turners Road Mile End Old Town
George Cutler 41 Head Married  Colour maker Bermondesy
Elizabeth Cutler 29 Wife Married Staffordshire
George Cutler 11 Son Stepney Middlesex
Elizabeth C Cutler 8 Daughter Limehouse Middlesex
John W Cutler 8  Son Limehouse Middlesex
Thomas H Cutler 5 Son Limehouse Middlesex
Phoebe A Cutler 6 months Daughter Miles End Old Town
Thomas W Cutler 39 Brother Married Warehouseman Bermondsey


With George and his family on the 1881 census in Limehouse is his widowed sister Mary Ann Shingleton aged 69 and born Shoreditch.

MARY ANN CUTLER
STEPHEN SHINGLETON  
Marriage:  02 JAN 1837   Saint Mary, Newington, Surrey

Thomas William Cutler was an engine driver in Bermondsey in 1861 with wife Jemima nee Cater who he married in 1860 in Stepney registration district. In 1881 he was in St Giles in the Fields with his wife. In 1891 he was in St Giles in the Field's workhouse. Brother George was still in Mile End.
 


Regards

Valda