Rose Ellen Twyman/Rose Wales/Ellen Rose Twyman - same person?

[tgit_1]

Hi there everyone,

I am looking into the Twyman last name.  Everyone on my father's side of the family has passed away so I am relying on hand written accounts from my grandmother.  Here is what I have found:

In my grandmother's mother's funeral service visitation book, my grandmother (Edith Joan Flannery Cook) lists her mother's name as Florence Edith Rose Cook Flannery Dawdy (pure coincidence that her mother's maiden name was Cook and she herself married a Cook - makes for confusing research).  In that record, she has written her mother's mother's name as being Rose Wales.  I have since been able to obtain a copy of Florence's 2nd marriage.  Florence states her mother's name is Ellen Rose Twyman.  My grandmother has also kept death notices from her relatives in England.  She has written on one for William Wales that this was Florence's  maternal grandfather.   She also has one for Charlotte Wales and has written that this is Florence's maternal aunt.  I have been able to find a Rose Ellen Twyman that gave birth to, coincidently, Florence Edith Rose Cook, who was married to a John Cook (this appears to match).  This is where I get confused.  I have found documents that state Rose Ellen Twyman's mother's name is Susannah Twyman (married to William Wales - good so far) but Susannah's father's name is James Twyman.  So it appears as follows:

James Twyman is Susannah Twyman Wales' father
Susannah Twyman Wales is Ellen Rose Twyman Cook's mother

It just seems odd that there are 3 generations of MATERNAL Twyman names.  I am curious to find out as to whether Ellen Rose Twyman and Rose Wales are the same person, and if so, was she perhaps born out of wedlock and then adopted by William Wales or is there a separate Twyman family unrelated to James Twyman and William Wales is a second husband.

Please help....I am so very confused!

Thanks

tgit

[CaroleW]

Hi

Could you include some info re: birthyears/birthplaces please

[tgit_1]

I am sorry...I got so caught up in the confusion with the names I forgot to put dates in

my grandmother's name:
Edith Joan Flannery Cook
b. - 7 Sep 1911, Margate, Kent
m. - 9 Jun 1938, London, Ontario, Canada
d. 21 Jun 1987, Dutton, Ontario, Canda

her mother:

Florence Edith Rose Cook Flannery Dawdy
b. - 4 Aug 1884, Margate, Kent
m. - approx 1910 to Patrick Flannery in Kent, he passed away Mar 1913
Jun 1920 emigrated to Canada
m. - 18 Oct 1922, Lawrence Stn, Ontario, Canada to Burlington Dawdy
d. - 15 Jul 1951, Lawrence Stn, Ontario Canada

her mother:

Rose Ellen Twyman/Rose Wales/Ellen Rose Twyman
b. approx 1861, Margate, Kent
m. to John Cook

her mother:

Susannah Twyman
b. approx 1835, Kent
m. to William Wales
d. Mar 1882

her mother:

Sarah Jordan
b. approx 1809
m. to James Twyman

I have found records that list her as Rose Ellen Twyman, Ellen Rose Twyman and Rose Wales....all three of them list the same parents.

Thanks again!

[CaroleW]

Marriages June qtr 1869     
Twyman  Susannah     Thanet  2a 1191   
WALES  William     Thanet  2a 1191   
 
1871 census - all children b Margate

134 High St Margate

William Wales 34  fish dealer b Hammersmith
Susannah   34  b Margate
Stephen Twyman 14 
Eliza Twyman 12 
Rose E Twyman 10 
Edward Twyman 8 
William Twyman 6 
George Twyman 4 
Charles Wales 1 
RG10; Piece: 991; Folio: 85; Page: 5

[CaroleW]

1861 census 7 Market St Margate

Indexed as Lyman

Stephen 33 butcher b Margate
Susan 26 b Kent
Stephen 3 b Margate
Eliza Ann 1 b Margate
RG9; Piece: 534; Folio: 107; Page: 26

Deaths March qtr 1868 
 
Stephen Twyman aged   39  Thanet  2a 464

[CaroleW]

1881 census - www.familysearch.org

All children b Margate

134 High St Margate

William WALES    44   b Hammersmith   Pork Butcher     
Susannah  44   b Margate, Kent
Stephen TWYMAN (WALES)   Son   23  Pork Butcher     
 Eliza TWYMAN (WALES)   Dtr    21    Pork Butcher     
 Rose TWYMAN (WALES)   Dtr    19    Pork Butcher     
 William TWYMAN (WALES)   Son    15  Pork Butcher     
 George TWYMAN (WALES)   Son   13   
 Charles WALES   Son   11   
 Anne WALES  dtr  8   
 Thomas WALES   Son   6   
 Walter WALES   Son   3   
 Richard JORDAN   Uncle   Widower   80 b  Deal Formerly Shoemaker 

[tgit_1]

Thanks CaroleW,

So I guess my question now is, why do the children carry the Twyman name and is William Wales the father of the children who carry the Twyman name?

[Eyesee]

The way I see it.

Susannah JORDAN married Stephen TWYMAN in Sep qtr 1853, Thanet. They have a number of children
Stephen
Eliza
Rose Ellen Sep qtr 1861
Edward
William
George
all born as TWYMAN

Stephen TWYMAN dies Mar qtr 1868 as found by Carole

Susannah TWYMAN now a widow marries William WALES Jun qtr 1869

They have some children
Charles
Anne
Thomas
Walter
all born as WALES

The 1881 census on family search may list both surnames bu on A******y Stephen down to George are down as TWYMAN and Charles to Walter as WALES.

Susannah JORDAN appears to be daughter of Thomas Dixon JORDAN and Mary Ann FOSTER, baptised 4 Oct 1835 at Deal. The Richard JORDAN with the family in 1881 was Susannah's uncle and probably Richard Mount JORDAN. Quite a bit on the IGI about the JORDAN family around Deal.

Rose Emily TWYMAN's father was Stephen TWYMAN and her mother Susannah nee JORDAN. William WALES was her stepfather. In some census situations the TWYMAN children would, and probably should, have been enumerated as William WALES step sons and step daughters. This back then could also have been written as son in law and daughter in law, which had a different meaning then to what it does now.

There was a Susannah TWYMAN born 1835 at Dover, daughter of James and Sarah, but she married a John KITTELL in 1859.

Ian C

[Eyesee]

1841
Middle Street, Deal
Thomas JORDAN, 30, Bricklayer
Mary JORDAN, 30
Mary JORDAN, 10
William JORDAN, 8
Susannah JORDAN, 6
Thomas JORDAN, 4
Elizabeth JORDAN, 2
all born in Kent
HO107/466/B3/ED7/F4/P1

Ian C