Drummond -Scotland

[hijimhere]

Ours is a story of my grand father Alexander Drummond (d1941) lost his wife in 1928 who we think is buried in Alexandria.  Because of this the story in the family is that we had to "come off the road".

Regretably my father would never talk about our heritage or any family matters.
That we came from "tinkers", oh this is a word that has been corrupted from the Irish Galic for Tinsmith-tin worker-- I have olive coloured skin which it has been said is a sign of the Romany heritage, my two brothers and three sisters are also dark.

So we never knew my fathers aunts or uncles as he wouldn't speak of them and we had never visited any relations beyond my fathers own brothers and sisters.  On reflection we did have contact with one cousin of my fathers who was twice removed but very respectful of the Drummond heritage and name.
His Name was Archie Burke, a real likeable sort of bloke who had a very cheerful outlook.

This means it has been very hard to try to trace any links on his side.  My mother came from Aberdeenshire and had no connection with Tinkers.

Fron what we do know my grandfather who was Alexander had married Christina McCallum (d1928).  His father was also Alexander and he married Mary Mcfie--I should say jumped the broom as marriage wasn't a formalised church thing. 

Alexander and Christina we think did have a church wedding in 1898 in Greenock but we have not been able to prove that it was my paternal Gran and Grandad Drummond.

Another story which comes down is the scotish way of naming children.  The Drummond first born sons were always called Alexander, we don't know if this is a scotishtradition or if it is a Drummond one.  But the scottish patterns of naming are that the first boy would usually take the fathers father first name.  The first girl would take the mothers mother's first name. 

The next boy would be named after his father and the next girl after the mother.  Then subsequest children would be called after the fathers brothers and the girls were names after the mothers sisters.

My first born carries the middle name of Alexander as my wife chose his first name as Jamie.  I would be interested in any "Drummond-McCallum - McFie"
stories or know connections of any sort.

[Gadget]

Hi

Welcome to Rootschat 

I'm sorry that I don't know any travellers' stories but I have checked some records for you.

Alexander and Christina did marry in Greenock on 21 Sept 1898 (Church of Scotland). he was then 23 and a Basket Hawker (address given as 4 West Burn Street, Greenock) and Christina was 21 (address - 8 Hardie Lane, Greenock)

His parents were, as you say, Alexander Drummond, a Basket Hawker, and Mary m.s. McFie.

Christina's were George McCallum, Hawker (deceased) and Elizabeth, m.s Johnstone.

Witnesses were Rachel McCallum and  Donald Reid.

It might be worth checking for the parents' deaths on Scotlands People. This will give you their parents names:

www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk  It's pay to view but very reasonable.

Best regards


Gadget

[Gadget]

Hi again

I think that this might be your Archie Burke:


1901 Census

28 Dalrymple Street, Greenock
District  564/2 ED 1 page 11

Household of Patrick Sweeney a Lodging House keeper and mason

Archibald Burke, lodger, 26, tinsmith, b.Stirling
Bella Burke, 24, b. Aberfeldy
Duncan Burke, 4, b. Dunoon
Mary Burke, 1, b. Dunoon



Gadget

[Gadget]

According to the IGI ( www.familysearch.org ) , Alexander Drummond and Mary McFie had the following children:

1861 Mary - Balfron,Stirling
1863 Alexander - Callendar, Perth
1867 John - Port of Montieth, Perth
1869 James - Stralachan, Argyll
1871 Adam - Row, Dunbarton
1874 Alexander - Gargunnock, Stirling



Gadget

[Gadget]

Trying to link  Archie Burke to the Drummonds.

I think this is his birth (IGI)

5 Oct 1872 St Ninians, Stirling -  Archibald Burke. Parents - Alexander Burke and Mary MacDondald


On the 1881 census, the Burke family are living in a tent on Camiesken Shore, Cardross, Dunbartonshire
Parish 494 ED 4 page 230

Alexander Burke, 49, tinsmith, b. NK, Argyllshire
Mary, b. NK, Invernessshire
(9 children including Archibald, aged 9)
also
Mary Drummond*, daughter in law, 20, b. NK, Stirlingshire (could be married to either sons William, 19, or John, 21)
and their children
Alexander Burke,  2, b. NK, Stirlingshire
Mary Burke, 1 month, b. NK, Stirlingshire

* Is she the daughter of Alexander Drummond and Mary McFie b.Balfron, Stirling on my previous message.

I can list the whole family for you, if you'd like. However, I'm touch typing by the light of my laptop at the moment so it might take a while 


Gadget

[hijimhere]

Fantastic--thank you, really thank you.

the main problem is that we need to prove Alexander and Mary McFie are my paternal great grand parents.   The ones we think are right have nothing to connect them to my grandfather Alexander (d1941) Perth age 61 this is fairly certain as he never remarried and the address given is 13f Hunter Cres, Perth where I spent my formative years as my father took over the tenancy...that would make Alexander's dob 1880!

In 1898 that would make him 17/18 and not in his 20's.  Ideally we need a cencus record 1881/1891/1901 for alexander/Mary where we can tie down--could be that the ages were porkies for some reason???

Really appreciate what you have done and I have yet to absorb it
 

Jim

[hijimhere]

Just noticed your Alexander at Garnagunnock would be the right age in 1898 for the wedding Alexander.

However this leaves us with c1880 birth for my grandfather which is more likely.
His children were Mary, Christina, Alexander, John, Barbara and George my father.   Alexander and John ended up in Alexandria, Mary married John Rocks and ended in Kirkauldy, Barbara and my dad Perth and Christina in Forfar. 

I think I have the order right, so mary would be named after her grandmother, Christina after her mum, Alexander after his grandfather and father.

if the theory of naming works John Barbara and George would be aunt/uncles they were named after!

Jim 

[Gadget]

The ones we think are right have nothing to connect them to my grandfather Alexander (d1941) Perth age 61 this is fairly certain as he never remarried and the address given is 13f Hunter Cres, Perth where I spent my formative years as my father took over the tenancy...that would make Alexander's dob 1880!

In 1898 that would make him 17/18 and not in his 20's.  Ideally we need a cencus record 1881/1891/1901 for alexander/Mary where we can tie down--could be that the ages were porkies for some reason???

Hi Jim

The Alexander Drummond who died January 10th  1941 (usual residence 13 Hunters Crescent, Perth), aged 66  was the widower of Christina McCallum and his parents were Alexander Drummond, Basket maker (deceased) and Mary maiden surname McPhee,deceased.

I think this death cert does connect him. He is shown as 23 at his marriage in 1898 and 66 at his death in 1941, giving DoB of  circa 1875. This fits with the Alexander who was shown as b. Gargunnock, Stirling in 1874. I think the one b. 1863 must have died.


Regards



Gadget

[hijimhere]

wow--how did you do that--it must be spot on, we were always told that Alexander was 61 when he died--

I spoke to my elder brother this morning, he lives in Scotland, Sandy (Alexander) he says there a connection to Greenock where they got married do you have anything on that?

I cannot thank you enough.

Kind regards

jim