Author Topic: E-Petition for BMD access  (Read 8363 times)

Offline Rewcastle

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Re: E-Petition for BMD access
« Reply #27 on: Monday 02 February 09 22:57 GMT (UK) »
Ahh right,
 I seem to have a recollection of this subject a number of years ago. I might be wrong, but i think Guy may have given the correct answer at the time.

Personally, I prefer a copy from the parish register, all free to access, and a small price for a copy with the original handwriting.


Offline Sloe Gin

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Re: E-Petition for BMD access
« Reply #28 on: Monday 02 February 09 22:59 GMT (UK) »
I disagree, reducing the price doesn't mean people will purchase more and ultimately spend more.

If an item in a shop is offered at a 50% discount and you only want one item does the discount make you buy three and ultimately spend more money?

But with regard to certificates, you are only ever going to buy a certain amount anyway..

What I was getting at, is that we buy the certificates that we need to take us a step further.  But there may be others that aren't strictly necessary, but that we would like to see to satisfy curiosity, or fill in the picture.  

I'm sure few of us can afford to buy all the certs we might be interested in.
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Offline trish251

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Re: E-Petition for BMD access
« Reply #29 on: Monday 02 February 09 23:16 GMT (UK) »
I disagree, reducing the price doesn't mean people will purchase more and ultimately spend more.

If an item in a shop is offered at a 50% discount and you only want one item does the discount make you buy three and ultimately spend more money?

Probably worth discussing the concept with folks who research in Scotland. I have both English and Scottish ancestors and would have 20 to 1 Scottish certificates images  compared to English certificates - they cost 1.20 each - I buy many more at that price. I have certs for 3rd cousins, ggg aunts and all - very hard to resist at the price.

As Guy mentions - for family history uncertified images are all that is needed. The time and effort for "certification" is a waste of their time and my money

Trish

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Offline Mean_genie

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Re: E-Petition for BMD access
« Reply #30 on: Tuesday 03 February 09 01:32 GMT (UK) »
The changes that were proposed in Registration Review of 2002 would have been enacted under the provisions of the Regulatory Reform Act 2001. If this worked, it would have been a neat way of making the appropriate changes without an Act of Parliament.

There were some good proposals in the Review, but also some pretty bad ones, so it would have been a mixed blessing at best. It failed at the Parliamentary scrutiny stage, for a number of reasons. So we were back to square one, not for the first time - earlier attempts to change the law had always run out of parliamentary time.

The real sticking point is the wording in the 1836 Act that stipulates that information may only be given in the form of a certified copy. Fortunately for Scotland, the 1854 Act only mentions 'extracts'. That is one of the reasons Scotland has been able to set up a service like ScotlandsPeople, while England and Wales are stuck with the unwieldy business of having to produce certified copies, at about twice the cost of simple photocopies.

Certification is expensive because of the special paper used, the fact that every certificate blank has to be numbered and accounted for, the secure conditions under which stocks of them need to be kept, and the extra staff time involved in administering the system.

Realistically, more complete and detailed indexing as per Dove etc will be a help, if and when we see it, combined with the various UKBMD projects. But this will be some time coming, as the GRO have yet to make an announcment about how the remainder of the project will be progressed, if at all.

Mean_genie


Offline trish251

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Re: E-Petition for BMD access
« Reply #31 on: Tuesday 03 February 09 02:13 GMT (UK) »
Thanks mean_genie - very well explained.  I was slightly abrupt & should have mentioned it is not only England/Wales who have to provide certified copies. I can get English certificates faster and cheaper than most in my own country (Australia). We do have one state that provides online images, and two  providing transcripts - at a price about the same as an English certificate. I have many more Scottish certificates than Australian ones as well  :)

Trish

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Offline Just Kia

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Re: E-Petition for BMD access
« Reply #32 on: Tuesday 03 February 09 12:34 GMT (UK) »
While there is a difference in the Scotland and England/Wales system due to laws passed in the early/mid 1800s, this is now the early 2000s surely other laws have changed in that time? Why can't this law? Maybe if enough people were bothered then our law could be bought inline with Scotland's regarding BMDs?
Or maybe to allow the registers to be transcribed by BrightSolid or Ancestry or FreeBMD or some other group, thus taking the strain of providing the service off the government?
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Offline bagpuss

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Re: E-Petition for BMD access
« Reply #33 on: Tuesday 03 February 09 13:18 GMT (UK) »


"Given the seeming collapse of the DOVE project to digitise these records"

I am very saddened to hear that the project to digitalize birth marriage and death certificates is having problems, I for one was very excited at the prospect, I was hoping that the cost would be greatly reduced and waiting for certificates to arrive would become a thing of the past.

Is there any way that we can support this or any future project. I would happily make a donation to the project as I'm sure many other family historians would - after all it is us who would benefit from the scheme in the long run.

Sue
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Offline Selina

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Re: E-Petition for BMD access
« Reply #34 on: Tuesday 03 February 09 21:32 GMT (UK) »
If I could obtain English certificate images for the same price as the Scottish ones then I would buy very many more, all those that I would like but do not essentially need.

So a change in the wording of the legislation would make that possible.

It may be a waste of time, most petitions are, but then it is my choice how I waste my time.

It number of signatories is growing well.

Selina

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Offline Guy Etchells

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Re: E-Petition for BMD access
« Reply #35 on: Tuesday 03 February 09 22:06 GMT (UK) »


It may be a waste of time, most petitions are, but then it is my choice how I waste my time.

It number of signatories is growing well.

Selina



Granted it is your choice how you waste your time as you put it but consider this:
Each time a flawed attempt is rejected due to a poorly constructed argument the task of changing the minds of objectors gets that bit more complicated and difficult to achieve.

I wish the petition well but have no doubt of the outcome.
Cheers
Guy
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