bastardy bonds

[crunchie01]

well as we know he never married lydia, as she died age 73, single and a pauper. whatever the reason, i dont know, but 2 of her five illegimate children seem to be john marshall's.

[peggypatch]

Stibbard is right next to Little Ryburgh and Great Ryburgh is the next parish over.

I would think it is a pretty good bet that John Marshall was already married, particularly in view of the age difference between him and Lydia.

[crunchie01]

thanks, just got to try and find a marruage for him now and dig a bit into his family history, see if i find any clues.

[crunchie01]

just been checking my notes and richard married in 1925.

his first son he named john, could this be an indication maybe that his father was john marshall.

opinions appreeciated.

[peggypatch]

Could well be, he might have been the father of all of them, but I think to be sure you need to follow up the steps we have already mentioned regarding marriage certificates, wills etc.

If there was an ongoing relationship between them, then they may well have come to a private arrangement for him to provide financial assistance, in which case the parish would not have had to get involved and so no bastardy order been made.

By the way, I was searching newspapers today and checked two quarter session reports. There was no mention of bastardy orders being made. There were reports of appeals against orders, but there was no mention of what kind of order they were (could just as easily been removal orders as bastardy order). They mostly read something along the lines of: An appeal against an order made by the parish of X was upheld/overturned etc. So I really don't think a newspaper search would be worth your while.

[coombs]

Hi

If an unmarried woman became pregnant and the father wasnt yet free to marry the mother but could do soon even if it had to be just after the birth, either through the death of a sick wife, impending divorce or coming back from the Army, then the mothers family may have been told this and also the local authorities, and if the father was planning to marry the mother as soon as he could once the baby was born, then there probably wouldnt have been any need to have a maintenance or affliation order made.

If he couldnt marry the mother due to a very well wife, then he might even come to a private agreement but if there was no chance of the father marrying the mother, then it may seem likely that an order may have been made or if meither a private agreement or court agreement could be made then that is quite often when the mother passed the baby off as a sibling or the baby given up for adoption informally.

Ben

[peggypatch]

What also happened reasonably frequently was that the father would wait to see if the mother and child survived the birth before doing the decent thing. However, we know this was not the case here.

If there was no private arrangement made for maintenance and the mother refused to name the father (for which she could be imprisoned if she had been subject to a bastardy examination) so an order could be made, then it was down to the parish (or poor law union after 1834) to provide financial assistance. This is why the parish went to such lengths to discover who the father was.

Although no doubt some women did pass illegitimate children off as siblings, have them adopted etc. Actually a great many women had illegitmate children right in the parish where they had always lived and then went on to have more or to marry the father or another man entirely. I am not so convinced that this Victorian idea of great shame and disgrace was really the reality for 18th and 19th century ordinary village folk, because there were a heck of a lot of them at it!

[coombs]

Hi

I think it also may have depended on how strict the mothers father was as well.

Ben