How far back realisitically can I go >>>

[halfasheep]

basically, of all the lines I've been tracing back, I've hit 1900 before I go to Italy (peasants and farmers), 1851 before I go back to Ireland (1861 on another line), but one line appears to be Welsh and I think I have them back as far as 1791 in the Neath area.

There doesn't appear to be anyone of great mention in my family - not that they are not all important to me - but seem to be miners, or occupations to that effect.

I've not gone down parish records/LDS route before, and I'm trying to thicken out what I can find from BMD and censuses, possibly getting up to any living relatives before I go back any further (in the vague hope someone will have done everything for me already  ).

So the basic question is, how far back can I realistically look to go records-wise before my guys drop off the face of the planet? I'm not expecting to go back to the Norman conquest, but is there a possibility of getting back past 1750 at the very least in South Wales?

Any replies will be gratefully (and possibly frustratingly) acknowledged 

[behindthefrogs]

Parish Registers will take you back to 1538 if you are lucky.  The problem is that the further you go back the fewer of them survive.  Apart from that it very much depends on whether your family was rich, poor or neither. 

If they were a family entitled to a coat of arms then that leads to other sources.  Similarly if they owned or leased property then that gives further leads.  I have one branch back to 1450, admittedly with a few fairly weak links, based on the fact that they had property in the same area and it could be traced being passed from father to son etc..

David

[halfasheep]

Would be nice to back that far, but somehow I doubt that's going to happen - coat of arms - you're hoping!

Thanks for the info though - like I say, will concentrate more at this time on the readily (ie easy) resources that are about to beef everything up - should help me in the long run as I should be able to clarify info a little easier

[behindthefrogs]

Would be nice to back that far, but somehow I doubt that's going to happen - coat of arms - you're hoping!

It is not as unlikely as you think.  I have two lines where this has happened, one certain and one highly likely.  The certain one had three generations of ag labs before they started to descend from farming familes and eventually back in 1645 from a family who had a coat of arms which from the published herald's visitation took me back to 1582.  What you have to remember is that by the time you are in the 1600s you will have thousands of ancestral lines and so it just a matter of finding the interesting ones.

David

[halfasheep]

I suppose so - I'm just so used to finding more and more coal miners, I just don't think I'm going to find anyone with a higher status, but as you say, I may stumble across someone.

Saying that, I have seen stories of well to do families ending up as agricultural labourers as the intheritance ends up getting spread so thin, and the people who inherit the property/money just squander it.

[Charles IX]

How do you find out if someone in the family has a coat of arms? because on one line I have family members who were Ag Labs but they're parents and grandparents were farmers but Im finding it really hard to get futher back at moment, I know just because they were farmer doesnt mean that they might have come from money but like David said you never know 

Duke

[mike175]

You could try Debrett's (google books) for information about members of the aristocracy, but beware of making assumptions just because a name fits.

As for farmers, a high proportion of them would be called smallholders these days as they may have farmed very few acres, and most only rented their farm.

Mike.

[Charles IX]

Well I know that that farm they were on was 63 acers, would this be considerd as "smallholders" and I have another family line that had a 99 acer farm. How many acers would you consider to be "smallholders"?

[behindthefrogs]

How do you find out if someone in the family has a coat of arms?

Duke

There are various books which you will find in any major reference library which list coats of arms and the family which was entitled to them.

For example Fairbairn's Crests which details the crests which are found on the helmets in the coats of arms of British families.  Once the family and the county where they lived in the 1600s has been identified then you can find the Herald's Visitation to the county as published by the Harleian Society which will contain a pedigree for the family.  Alternatively you can just search these for your family name.

You then match the pedigree to the information you have about the family from other sources.

Alternatively if you find papers from the family in various archives the seal will often bear the coat of arms.

There is of course the very expensive way which is to ask the College of Arms but that costs hundreds of pounds to find the details even if you give them the basic facts.  I was quoted £125 some years ago when I asked for the Blazon (written description) of the arms and pedigree of someone for whom I knew the exact date when they were knighted.  I knew that the arms were derived from those of the family some 200 years earlier and this information should have shown me how he was linked.

You will find Debrett's in your reference library as well. se

David