Smith

[tiggi]

Ok found same lady in 1871 Census seems her middle name is Cox not caroline 

[cathayb]

please believe me i am not trying to but in but i do know a bit about william packman.from london.he was not a gypsy but as you say married into them.he married first the cooper girl and they had kids together.he then came to cornwall(he used to travel london to cornwall selling fern.that is what the packmans were famous for)on his stay in cornwall he had a brief affair with naomi bland and a boy child was born but died young.he then was in devon and married louise orchard.the tree from then on is fairly well documented already in places.it is said at his funeral two of his sons turned up from the cooper marrage and the orchard marriage and they were both called bill packman!!!!!sorry to have butted in but i hope this helps a little.
i think but am not sure that naomi bland is connected to the jeff family(maybe thats where the Jeffreys come into it having shortened the name to jeff???i dont know)

[ellie_downunder]

 Quote : he had a brief affair with naomi bland and a boy child was born but died young.he then was in devon and married louise orchard.

He might not of been a gypsy, but he sure was a traveler 

[ellie_downunder]

Hi everyone just wanted to wish you all a very Merry and safe Christmas  , I am still working on my Smith / Packman line
but without all of your help I would not be where I am today, which is not much further than you guys put me 
I just want to know how other researchers manage to trace their trees back to Adam and Eve ?   ( well i might exaggerate a little but you get my meaning ) I am trying to find 1700s marriages and births that are even older than the settlement of my country, Its mind blowing  will post them soon as it might help someone else, cheers Ellie

[ellie_downunder]

Hi Tiggi, Barb and Cath, I have been doing further research into my Packmans,  Cath could you please tell me more on the William Packman that you spoke about, do you know what year he was born or anything else, There seems to be a couple of William Packman's that were out there  and a few on my branch also
I have been walkabout looking for anything I could find relating to this family, I don't think I would be allowed to post too much at once but here goes, I thought I would just put some of the  marriages up that may help Tiggi ?

George Henry Noble   Alice Wiltshire Dalton   28 May 1885   
Albert Clealand Packman   Sarah Ann Southgate   25 Dec 1866   
Henry Packman   Eliza Butler   1853   
Henry Packman   Mary Fryer   04 Sep 1787   
Herbert Charles Packman   Eliza Pearson   1896   
John Packman   Mary Colfield   06 Nov 1778   
Richard Packman   Mary Whitehead   22 Oct 1769   
Samuel Packman   Julia Booth   1888   
Samuel Packman   Louisa Clark      
Samuel Packman   Martha   1789   
Samuel Packman   Sarah Monk   03 Mar 1778   
Samuel Packman   Martha Elizabeth Sims   28 Mar 1896   
Samuel Packman   Keturah WHIFFIN      
Thomas Packman   Griswell Ashden   25 Apr 1706   
Thomas Packman   Sarah Cooper   24 Jan 1769   
Thomas Packman   Emma HINDE   Dec 1848   
Thomas Packman   Mary      
Thomas Packman   Elizabeth Mills   30 Sep 1740   
Thomas Packman   Ann Wallis   Abt. 1815   
William Packman   Mary Ann Cheal   1820   
William Packman   Maryann Wells      
Thomas Perriere   Elizabeth Packman   03 Jan 1776
Richard Head   Mary Packman   05 Jan 1761   
  unknown    Jeffrey        Eliza Packman      
Timothy Jessup   Elizabeth Packman   28 Sep 1770   
Michael Dean Fletcher   Sarah Packman   26 Oct 1776   
George Gibson   Sarah Packman   
Henry Dalton   Clara Packman
Charles William Silsbury   Florence BACHE   23 Jan 1897   
Robert Simpson   Clara Chambers   02 Nov 1873   
Robert Simpson   Jane Tiploft   1840   
Reuben Smith   Elizabeth Packman      
Thomas Smith   Philadelphia Hilstead      
Thomas Smith   Dorcas Turner   1778   
Richard Squibb   Mary Packman   18 Aug 1739   
James Tiptaft      Christiana Connell   12 Jul 1802   
Robert Whitehead   Lydia Packman   02 Oct 1782   
Timothy Wilshire   Clara Packman

Name places related to the above packman families are
Shoreham, Otford, Kensing, Halstead, Knockholt, cudham, Bromley, Farnborough, Beckenham, Eynsford, Dartford,
Ash ?, Swanscombe Greenhithe, Fawkham, Snodland, cobham,

[cathayb]

there were at least 3 william packmans!!!1 was the father born london b.1864. and then he had 2 sons both called william from two of his women!!!!!the packmans although they married into travellers werent actually gypsies.they sold fern in the london which i presume they got from the west country and took back to sell.they did very well forthemselves anyway.happy new year cathay

[Gypsy123]

Just thought......... the line of Packman that came from London I am sure it was a Tom Packman could this be thomas ? you have listed ?
 i will check and see what I have on him

William Pacman had a son Tom, his son Bill was a scrap dealer, he died last year tom is also gone

[cathayb]

the packmans are now quite a large family round devon areas.the will packman who died last year was not the orginal one from london as i am sure yiou realise?i have a couple of packman trees and am in touch with williams descendants now in devon.i cant mention names cause living folk but you seem to be from the west country gypsy123.do i know you?if so pm me and i can tell you more.

[Gypsy123]

Quote : he had a brief affair with naomi bland and a boy child was born but died young.he then was in devon and married louise orchard.

He might not of been a gypsy, but he sure was a traveler 

yes you are wright there he was not born a Gypsy but he was a Traveller,
nothing to be ashamed of having Gorgi Blood it hapens all the time Gypsies marry Gorgis, well Cath knows that, as she is a none Gypsy married to a Gypsy, its me Cath Sally how are things