Author Topic: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh  (Read 19365 times)

Offline StevenG

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Re: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh
« Reply #18 on: Wednesday 19 November 08 10:45 GMT (UK) »
... except that there IS a Thomas Green, baptised May 27th 1770, to Richard and Susanna.  I must have missed this one while transcribing out of the registers, back before the IGI was online.

So, this looks like good circumstantial evidence in favour.

(Sorry about my previous post.)
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline redgum

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Re: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh
« Reply #19 on: Wednesday 19 November 08 10:53 GMT (UK) »
Hi SteveG

My family for Richard GREEN & Susannah SIMONS

Boy d at b 7/6/1674
Elizabeth 7/9/1766
Susannah 17/2/1769 d 2/5/1769
Thomas 27/5/1770
Mary 27/7/1774
Richard b 2/8/1778 d 12/1/1812

 Also for the Richard b 6/2/1737 who married Susannah Simons
His father is Thomas GREEN and mother Elizabeth.

Regards
Robyn
SCOTLAND
Macdonald, Buchan, Stuart, McCook -Angus/ Aberdeenshire
McLeod, McKenzie- Sutherland
 
IRELAND
McIlhagga, Craig - Antrim

ENGLAND
Stone, Murch, Ireland, Austin, Perryman - Devon
Holder, Robinson -Warwickshire/Staffordshire

Offline wdurham

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Re: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh
« Reply #20 on: Wednesday 19 November 08 11:55 GMT (UK) »
Aha! The plot thickens!

"Edward  born to Eleanor b 28 February 1831 in Thurleigh"

I wonder why she didn't take him to Ravensden when she married John Armstrong? Or perhaps she did - we only have the 1841 census as a guide to who lived where, and though Edward is with his granny in Thurleigh, that could have been just a visit.  His wife Sarah was a Bolnhurst girl, but all three villages are so close. I might send for the marriage certificate of Edward and Sarah - which would give his residence on marriage.

Though there is no sign of Edward and Sarah after 1851 following a quick look - I wonder if they emigrated as well?

Willson & Pell in Faversham, Egerton, Folkestone in Kent
Cornhill in Kent, Devon and Wokingham, Berks
Cadmans & Kings in Isleham, Cambs
Swan, Gregory, Smith & Mingay in the Burrough Green/Westley area of Cambs
Armstrong & Chandler in Bedford
Abbott/Abbit in Witham, Essex
Davies/Davis in Islington & Hackney

Offline johnP-bedford

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Re: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh
« Reply #21 on: Wednesday 19 November 08 17:45 GMT (UK) »
The Thurleigh PR transcription states on the burial on 12 Jan 1812 of Rich Green the age "38."  - most likely where the NBI got it's figure from.

I went to Beds Archives today & checked the original book used to record the baptisms & burials at Thurleigh.  It IS definitely '38' & not anything like '33' . My mate Trevor who works in the records office concurs with me.  Assuming that was right at that time & nobody was guessing then how old was poor dead Richard, we take it he was born 1774 - but not necessarily baptised then.
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Partridge - North Beds; Northants & Peterborough
Bishop - Bedford; Hunts, Hemingford Grey
Allen - Hunts, Hemingford Abbotts
Clement - Croydon
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Offline johnP-bedford

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Re: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh
« Reply #22 on: Wednesday 19 November 08 17:52 GMT (UK) »
More info;  Charles Green's first marriage to Hannah Lovell on 11 Oct 1824 was in presence of William Green & Sarah Darlow.

His 2nd marriage on 26 Apr 1835 of course has him as a widower, & it is to Elizabeth Ann Brown, in the presence of William Holley & G F Whateley.

Their daughter Mary Ann was baptised 15 Nov 1835

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Partridge - North Beds; Northants & Peterborough
Bishop - Bedford; Hunts, Hemingford Grey
Allen - Hunts, Hemingford Abbotts
Clement - Croydon
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Offline bedfordshire boy

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Re: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh
« Reply #23 on: Wednesday 19 November 08 18:01 GMT (UK) »
Hi John

I think Richard was born and baptised in 1778. The 1 jan 1782 census gives his age as 3 years 6 months, which would mean he was about 6 weeks old at baptism. Bog standard baptism! More likely it's the 38 that's wrong either because it's an error, or he'd been pulling the wool over his family's eyes ever since he got married.

David
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Beds:   Cople: Luke/Spencer
            Everton: Hale
            Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey/Rook
            Potton:  Merrill
            Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey/Rook
            Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt
Hunts:   Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock
            Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn         
Cambs: Bourn: Bowd
            Eltisley: Medlock
            Graveley: Ford/Revell

Offline wdurham

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Re: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh
« Reply #24 on: Wednesday 19 November 08 18:33 GMT (UK) »
Having done some transcription from scans of parish records for the Kent FHS, I can see how 33 and 38 could be confused, especially in the early 1800s when so few people were literate. Some parish incumbents had handwriting that you wouldn't normally gratify with the name!

And there is always the point that Richard MIGHT just have lied about his age on marriage (a) to get around the consent rules as his father was dead and mother apparently on parish relief and/or (b) to avoid having to admit to his wife-to-be that he was still only a boy by comparison with her, and then was obliged to sustain the deception.  Mary Elderkin would have been the informant for his burial, and she may well have believed he was the same age as her instead of 3-4 years younger.

It's still an anomaly, but one we are never likely to be able to resolve....in the meantime, given the quality of all the other research, I think - like Robyn - that I am inclined to accept Richard as my gggg-grandfather.

And thanks, John-P , for checking the original. I will also folow up the Charles witnesses.
Willson & Pell in Faversham, Egerton, Folkestone in Kent
Cornhill in Kent, Devon and Wokingham, Berks
Cadmans & Kings in Isleham, Cambs
Swan, Gregory, Smith & Mingay in the Burrough Green/Westley area of Cambs
Armstrong & Chandler in Bedford
Abbott/Abbit in Witham, Essex
Davies/Davis in Islington & Hackney

Offline redgum

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Re: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh
« Reply #25 on: Wednesday 19 November 08 21:37 GMT (UK) »
 I agree that it is more likely to an error on the death record re the age of Richard possibly by the informant, if not an original transcription mistake.

I just wanted to say Wendy, Richard is also my "other half's" 4x grandfather.
Not sure what relationship that will make you both but a cousin of sorts (and an inlaw to me). Nice to meet you! :D

In a different family branch we have a widow remarrying with a 2 year old child. Documents show the second husband rejected the child and he was brought up by his two sets of grandparents. So sad! But times were different and harsh. My heart went out to his mother. Our child was well loved but it is unclear how much contact his mother was "allowed" with him.
It looks like Edward was included and cared for too.

Regards
Robyn

SCOTLAND
Macdonald, Buchan, Stuart, McCook -Angus/ Aberdeenshire
McLeod, McKenzie- Sutherland
 
IRELAND
McIlhagga, Craig - Antrim

ENGLAND
Stone, Murch, Ireland, Austin, Perryman - Devon
Holder, Robinson -Warwickshire/Staffordshire

Offline bedfordshire boy

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Re: Charles GREEN of Thurleigh
« Reply #26 on: Thursday 20 November 08 12:48 GMT (UK) »
But John looked at the original parish register, which was definitely 38, so it can't have been a transcription error. Unless you're referring to the register itself as being a transcription, from rough notes made by the vicar

David
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Beds:   Cople: Luke/Spencer
            Everton: Hale
            Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey/Rook
            Potton:  Merrill
            Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey/Rook
            Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt
Hunts:   Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock
            Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn         
Cambs: Bourn: Bowd
            Eltisley: Medlock
            Graveley: Ford/Revell