Cruddas / Cruddace family from Newcastle

[Chrislats]

Hi

Thanks everyone for your replies! I'm overwhelmed by the response.

I am pretty certain I have the correct birth certificate for William Cruddace (Sept Q 1853 10b 40). I have traced gr-grandfather William back through the 1901, 1891 and 1881 censuses and all show his birth as 1853 in Newcastle. I know they are the correct censuses as his daughter (my grandmother) appears and I know her details are correct.

I found a marriage for William Cruddes to Isabella Brown in June Q 1875 (10b 292). I know my gr=grandmother was Isabella so am fairly sure this is him. His first child was born in 1876 which ties in date wise. Before that he disappears.

I also found the census for 1871 showing William living with grandmother Jane Savage and thought this must be him but his birth certificate shows his mother as Elizabeth Nixon. I suppose Jane Savage could be Elizabeth Nixon's mother and either Jane remarried a Savage or Elizabeth was originally a Savage and married a Nixon before marrying William Cruddace. (Confused yet?!!! I am!)

I guess William's father could have died and his mother Elizabeth remarried to a Savage, making Jane her mother-in-law. I did find two deaths for a William Cruddas in March Q 1862 and Sept Q 1865
but have not found a marriage for Elizabeth Cruddas after that date.

However, even if one of these deaths is my William's father where is he in 1861? William would have been 8 and I cannot find any census that has a William of that age. The nearest I have found is for a William Darnell Cruddace born 1849 who has parents called William and Elizabeth, but I have tracked him on later censuses when I know where my William was, so have dismissed him.

I have ordered William and Isabella's marriage certificate to see if that throws any more light on it.

Thanks again for your help.

Chrislats

[JenB]

Not sure if this is relevant but in 1871 there is a William Cruddas grandson of Jane Savage in Newcastle  RG10 5090 55 22
Jane Savage 78 b Beverley Yorks
James Cruddas 20 gson lab b Carlisle
William Cruddas 18 gson lab b Newcastle
Margaret Cruddas 16 gdau b Newcastle

Worth keeping on the back burner just in case.    I cannot find them earlier.
Andrea

This looks like the same family in 1861, although try as I might I cannot make Savage out of mother in law's name! The page has been damaged, so some birthplaces are not clear.

RG 9/ 3822/ Folio 80/ Page 17b/ Schedule 141
Bankside, Newcastle on Tyne

William Crudace, head, Wid^r, 29, iron moulder, Yorkshire ?
George do, son, 13, scholar, Cumberland ?
James do, son, 10, scholar, do
William do, son, 8, scholar, Newcastle
Margaret J. do , daur, 6, scholar, do
Jane Charge, mother in law, w, 65, Yorkshire, Beverley.

William senior's age is definitely given as 29, although the transcription gives it as 39.

Jennifer

[sillgen]

That was my own reading of the name as I did not look at the transcription.  I could have got it completely wrong.  Would not be the first time!  I have just looked again and the transcription has Savage too.  I cannot find your 1861 entry for some reason.
Andrea

[JenB]

That was my own reading of the name as I did not look at the transcription.  I could have got it completely wrong.  Would not be the first time! 

Sorry Andrea, I meant that I couldn't make Savage out of the name on the 1861 entry which I found, not the one which you provided

Jennifer

[JenB]

There is a death for an Elizabeth Cruddace, 4th quarter 1859, Newcastle on Tyne 10b 43.

[sillgen]

Yes, I realised that JenB.  Have now found the 1861 entry - not like Savage I agree.  Let us know when you get that marriage certificate Chrislats.
Andrea

[Chrislats]

Thanks for that. The 1861 entry certainly looks like it could be them. I suppose Charge and Savage said in a strong accent could be misinterpreted as each other to a hard of hearing census taker! I've certainly found other relatives with phonetic spellings that look nothing like the real name.

Still can't work out where Elizabeth Nixon comes into the equation though. Maybe it isn't the right birth certificate, although I couldn't find any others in 1853. I'll certainly report back when the marriage certificate arrives. Let's hope it sheds some light.

Chrislats

[JenB]

I suppose Charge and Savage said in a strong accent could be misinterpreted as each other to a hard of hearing census taker!

Alternatively they wrote it so badly that 'Charge' was the best the enumerator could make of it.

I suppose that as a cross-check that you have got the right certificate for your William you could get that for his younger sister, Margaret J, aged 6 in 1861.
Margaret Jane  Cruddace, 1q 1855, Newcastle on Tyne 10b 56.

Oddly, I can't find birth registrations for the two older siblings, supposedly born in Catlisle.

[Chrislats]

Thanks JenB. I'll do that.

I haven't been able to find George or James in Carlisle either. I did find a George Cruddace on 1881 census who is the right age but he was born in Houghton-le-Spring, Durham. I know some of my other relatives have varying birthplaces listed on different census returns. Basically you can't trust any of them can you?!

Chrislats