Death look up help please. COMPLETED

[pettsy]

Mum just telephoned me with the details of the death certificate.

Thomas Dwyer died 25th May 1902. In Kensington Infirmary.
He was 63y and a Furniture Porter.

Informant of death was his daughter Mary Hickely 

It is not my Thomas as he wasn't a furniture packer, nor did he have a daughter called Mary 

Wonder where he is then?
I am going to try different variants of his name.

Any ideas?

Thanks Pettsy

[ninakin]

Hi Pettsy,

What a shame! It seemed to be such a good match - sorry!
I'll have a look for him if you could provide some info like place of birth, wife's name, children, occupation, where he was in the various censuses. Any usual misspelling of Dwyer I should look for?

Ninakin

[pettsy]

Hi Nanakin,

Please don't be sorry , it was worth a shot 

Right I will give you all I have on Thomas Dwyer.

1) He was born in 1837, Chelsea or Marylebone.

2) He was married to (still found no marriage cert, so I guess cohabiting) with Jane Dwyer nee McManus b.1845, Chelsea.

3) Their children were John b.1863, Catherine b.1865, Thomas b. 1868, Alice Jane b. 1871? and Caroline Ellen b.1873.

4) I have Thomas on census in 1841, 1871 & 1881.

5) Jane McManus 1851, 1871 & 1881.

6) Thomas was named as father, General Dealer.
No mention of deceased or not?

7) On Jane's death cert 26th Dec 1916, she was named as WIDOW of Thomas Dywer, a General dealer.
She died in College Place, Chelsea.
Daughter Catherine Rudd present at her death.

On the 1881 census they were living at New Peter St, Westminster. All born Chelsea.
John had left home, Alice died, and Caroline is called Fanny.


Maybe his was already dead at the time of Caroline's marriage.

I tried Dwyre with no luck.

Thanks for your help.

Pettsy


 

[ninakin]

He's not an easy man to find your Thomas Dwyer. I can't find him, or even the other Thomas Dwyer whose death certificate you have, in the 1901. Does the death certificate say it's his daughter? Could it be granddaughter, or any other relative? (or even a daughter from previous marriage?) I have an ancestor whose death certificate has his 'daughter' as informant, but she was in fact his second wife's niece who looked after him the last few years.
His occupation as a furniture porter, is this something he could have been doing the last few years?

There is another death which could fit, but this was before his daughter's marriage:
1888 Apr-May-Jun Poplar, Thomas Dwyer, born abt. 1843.
It wouldn't necessarily say father deceased on his daughter's marriage certificate even if he was, or at least, that's my experience.

Is there a possibility he was married to someone else and his wife was alive? Perhaps this is the reason we can't find a marriage for him and Jane McManus.

Sorry I can't be of more help, good luck with finding him!

Ninakin

[pettsy]

I won't have the cert until Weds, but mum said it said it was his daughter.

As far as I can work out he had three daughters.
One was Caroline my great gran, Alice who died young, and Catherine who married a Mr Rudd.

I do believe that Thomas and Jane never married.
And I had trouble finding his children with Jane apart from my great gran, the last child born who was born CAROLINE ELLEN DWYER.

Valda found John McManus, Thomas Dwyer McManus, Catherine Dwyer McManus.
Which I guess proves they never married.
I am going to order Thomas Dwyer McManus birth cert on Weds.

Of course this death still could be "my" Thomas and it was his daughter by his first marriage 
And he changed jobs which lots have going by my various census.

Could he have died abroad? Is there an index for deaths abroad?

Pettsy
Oh the plot thickens.

[ninakin]

It certainly looks like Thomas and Jane never married if their children were found as Dwyer McManus. At least there should be no doubt as to who the father is. When it comes to deaths abroad I have no idea, but I guess you should ask yourself how likely it would be that a man of his age would travel abroad, and why, given his occupation. Never say never of course!

Perhaps you could have a look for another marriage for Thomas? He was older than Jane so could have married someone else a few years before meeting her and having John, their first child. I would guess it could be a London/Middlesex marriage as this is where he came from, but there's no guarantee.

Good luck with ordering the Thomas Dwyer McManus certificate - hopefully you will get a new clue as to who Thomas was. Keep us posted!

Ninakin

[pettsy]

Thanks for you help.

I will keep you posted, I am intrigued now.

Pettsy 

[pettsy]

I decided to have another look at the death cert, as I still can find no other death cert which comes near to my Thomas.

His daughter was named as  Mary Hickey, living at 47, Hunt St.

I found a marriage for William Hickey and Mary Dwyer Sept Q 1890, 1a 342b, Kensington.
They are also on the 1901 census, same address, 47, Hunt St.

[ninakin]

That looks promising! I found the marriage, but I looked for Mary and William Hickey in the 1901 but couldn't find them (can't search on address), what is the reference, and how old is she?

Ninakin