Parents of Isabella Gatt (born c 1815, Aberdour)?

[Stanza]

I am hoping someone can help me identify the parents of my G-Grandmother Isabella Gatt, who was born (according to census records) about 1815 in Aberdour parish (probably Pennan), married Andrew Simpson in 1841 in Rathen, and died in 1900 in Fraserburgh.

Unfortunately the informant for her death certificate got mixed up and the names shown for her parents are actually the parents of her husband Andrew Simpson.

I found a candidate in the IGI (Batch C111692) and OPR:  (Isabel GAAT b May 1813, daughter of Alex & Barbra GAAT).  Although her dates match the census records for "my" Isabella reasonably closely, it seems that she is the Isobel Gatt who married John (or William) Milton in 1842 and can be traced through the censuses until her death in 1883, when the certificate confirms her to have been the daughter of Alexander & Barbara Gatt (ms Gatt). So she is NOT the Isabella who married Andrew Simpson.

It is probable that Isabel Gaat b 1813 is one of  the 2 Isabella Gatts aged 25 in the 1841 census who are of the right age, one in Pennan and one in Gamrie (the neighbouring parish, in Banffshire).  Isabella in Pennan is only a few census lines away from Andrew Simpson, and so I have been assuming  (with no other evidence to support it) that she is “my” Isabella, which would leave Isabella in Gamrie to be the Isabel Gaat b 1813.

There was another Isabel Gaat born in Aberdour in 1823 (to James Gaat & Barbara Taylor), but the age seems wrong, and  I cannot find her in the 1841 census.

But nothing in this gives me any information as to who were the parents of the Isabella Gatt who married Andrew Simpson  in 1841 – so can anyone help, or suggest a further line of investigation?

 

[kenjo]

Hi Stanza,
Can you list her children?
There could be a pattern to follow.
Jo

[KirstyG]

Hi Stanza,

Have you viewed the actual marriage entry from Isabella and Andrew? They sometimes name the father of the bride.

There are a lot of Gatts on the MI index for Aberdour, but unfortunately no Isabella.

Having looked at Freecen for 1841 I can see why! A quick check of the IGI would indicate that the Barbra living with Isobel is not her sister, but belongs to William and Agnes Gatt a few doors down. Chances are the whole Gatt family are related one way or another, but it's a pretty big mess to sort out!
If you feel that it would help to unravel them, I am always up for a challenge 


Kirsty

[Stanza]

Hi Jo & Kirsty

Thanks for your interest - any help you can give to disentangle the Gatts of Pennan would be truly appreciated - it's just my bad luck that Isabella's death certificate showed completely the wrong information.

To answer the points raised:

Sadly there is nothing on the OPR for the marriage of Andrew & Isabella to indicate who Isabella's parents were. The record just says they are "both in this parish" (Aberdour).

The children of Isabella & Andrew Simpson that I have identified were twins James (b 1842) & Jane/Jean (b 1842), probably another James (b 1845), Isabella (b 1848) and George (b 1857) - but there may have been others as the children's birth dates show a big gap. I am descended from Isabella.

Andrew's parents were William & Jean (ms Henderson).

Kirsty - I'm interested in your comment about Barbra in 1841 - have you identified who she might be?

[KirstyG]

Hi Stanza

I might be wrong about Barbra, I just looked at possible births on the IGI and then at neighbouring households on Freecen in 1841, the ages and and names fit perfectly I think. There were not that many possible on the IGI to choose from. I didn't save anything i'm afraid, i was just doing a first pass to see what looked likely. I could probably find it again if you have trouble, but it was all pretty straightforward...


Kirsty

[KirstyG]

I will see if I can retrace my steps. Please feel free to point out unacceptable leaps of assumption!

In 1841 an Isobel Gatt aged 25 (rounded) is listed as residing Pennan Aberdour, Aberdeenshire.
At this same address is a Barba Gatt aged 15. Both born Aberdeenshire. [folio 1 page 9]

The IGI has a birth of Barbra Gatt in May 1830 to William Gatt and Agnes Williams, Aberdour. (Extracted)

a nearby residence  -also Pennan [folio 1 page 8] has a Barbra Gatt aged 9, and another aged 50.

another -also Pennan [folio 1 page 8] has William Gatt, Agnes Gatt and 7 children, all under 15.


My first assumption was that the Barbra living with Isobel was likely the daughter of this William and Agnes, however it is also possible that the Barbra living with elder Barbra is their daughter.

As you had discounted your first Isabella that you found in the IGI I was trying to ascertain who the parents might have been by matching up siblings, but as William and Agnes have a younger daughter Isobel with them it is unlikely that the two girls shared the same parents. If the other Barbra ( aged 9) is theirs then that reopens the possibility.

I'm sorry if that is a bit garbled, it's late and i'm tired.

Have you traced Isabella in all the later census records? there is always a chance that a family member stayed with her.


Looking at SP there are only the two births that you have already mentioned in 1813 and 1823. All Is*bel* Gatt/Gaats born between 1800 and 1854 were born in Aberdour.


If you want help I am happy to oblige, but it may have to wait until I am a bit more awake tomorrow...


Kirsty

[Stanza]

Hi Kirsty

As I said, I'm grateful for any help! I suspect that any answer is going to be "on the balance of probablilities" rather than any definitively proved answer, as there appear from the census returns to have been two Isabella Gatts born c 1816 in Aberdour parish, but only the one "Isabel Gatt b 1813" in the OPRs - and sadly I'm pretty convinced (see my first post) that she is not "my" Isabella.

I printed out from Freecen all the Gatts in Aberdour, hoping that I could identify potential parents for a 25-year old Isabella Gatt (bearing in mind that one or both may have already died).  There were too many possibilities, and nothing decisive.

In the 1851 census, Andrew & Isabella Simpson have a 19-year old visitor, Isabella Gatt. From Scotlandspeople, I think this could be the 25 year old Isabella who got married in April 1858 to William Ritchie, and if so then she was the daughter of George & Jean Gatt (ms Gatt!). That would place her in the 1841 census as the daughter of Jean (age 37) on Folio 1 Page 7. Possibly she was "my" Isabella's cousin, but then probably every Gatt in Pennan was a cousin!!!!

In all the other census returns there are no other Gatt visitors.

[Stanza]

Hi Kirsty (me again)

I think the 15-yr old Barbra Gatt in the 1841 census (with 25-yr old Isobel) is the Barbra Gatt who married John Gatt in Oct 1851, according to the OPR.

I tracked her in the 1851 census as a servant in Pennan, then with her husband John in the 1861,  1871 and 1881 census (with 3 children), and she died on 11 Nov 1884.

From her death certificate, she was the daughter of James Gatt and Barbara Gatt (ms Taylor). Now, interestingly, this James & Barbara were also the parents of the Isabel Gaat born in 1823! If this was "my" Isabella who married Andrew Simpson in 1841 she would have been old enough to marry, but her age doesn't then correspond with her age recorded in the 1841 or subsequent censuses.

The other possibility of course is that the birth of "my" Isabella Gatt c 1816 just wasn't recorded at all in the parish register!

[nikandjb]

Hi @Stanza and @KirstyG

It's been interesting reading this thread as  Barbara Gatt who married John Gatt in 1851 are my 3x great-grandparents and John's parents are William Gatt and Agnes Gatt.

John had a sister called Isabella, born in 1835, and the other Isabella(born 1823) on my tree is the daughter of Agnes' brother James Gatt, who married Barbara Taylor. One of James' and Barbara's daughter is the Barbara Gatt mentioned above who married her cousin John!
It does get really convoluted! But I'm enjoying the unravelling as I've never met another Gatt who isn't in my immediate family!