Can someone please date this lady and baby for me? COMPLETED - THANKS EVERYBODY

[Maggie.]

Mothers needing to return to work in the mill after giving birth, in order to put bread on the table would put the child out to be nursed.  The child would be given 'sleeping stuff', readily available from the druggist for a few pence under various names - Mother's Helper, Infant's Quietness, Soothing Syrup, James’ Fever mixture to name a few. The thing they had in common was the inclusion of opiates.

The child would be dosed again to allow the parents to get some rest at night.  Many children died through over dosage.

Maggie

[PaulaToo]

Can't see the dress being dark brown. If the baby had just died it would be black black, not dark brown black, I'm sure.
I don't think it looks like a PM card. I just think it's a tired lady with a 'spaced out baby,' and I do think she has as much smile as she can muster.

Very interesting thread. I missed it in the beginning. So pleased it resurfaced.

[Rabbit B]

Hi Everyone,

Here is my take on the subject!  "knackered Mum, baby with ? colic and nobody getting any sleep"  Both of them worn out!

I had one like that and my eyes looked the same!

Rabbit B 

[Maggie.]

There is a possibility that this lady is the 1st wife of my gt. grandfather.  If it is her, I know from the newspaper obituary that she died in January 1872.  She had 2 children born 1868 and 1870 who both survived to adulthood.  Yesterday I found evidence of the birth of a 3rd child born 1871 (after the census so I hadn't picked him up).  I have found the death of a child of the same name (and its not a common name) in the June Qtr of 1872, aged 0 years, that is to say within a few months of his mother if this scenario is correct (certificates sent for to hopefully confirm this).

I wonder whether this picture was taken in the knowledge that Mum and baby were both seriously ill.  Mum doesn't look like she was a 'regular' in the photographic studio, the family probably couldn't have afforded it, but perhaps it was felt that a 'memorial' photo was an appropriate expense.       

Maggie

[PaulaToo]

Baby looks a bit more than 0 years... but quite possibly it could be one of the others, perhaps a first birthday photo, and Mum is beginning to wish she wasn't starting another one already.

[Maggie.]

Do you think so Paula? -- I put that child at about 8-9 months old.  We have a grandchild of that age and she looks around the same size.  The '0' years was from the GRO register where any child of less that 12 months is listed as '0'.

[charlotteCH]

maggie, This is a fascinating discussion  and all new ideas to me.

RE the delay in telling us what you learn from the certs that are coming... why not put your holiday off?

[PaulaToo]

I'm thinking the child is a little older, because they didn't have the good food we do, and tended to be smaller, no other reason.
You're right Charlotte, this is a fascinating discussion.

[Maggie.]

maggie, This is a fascinating discussion  and all new ideas to me.

RE the delay in telling us what you learn from the certs that are coming... why not put your holiday off?

No way, Charlotte - I've waited a long time for my hols. 

With a bit of luck the death certs. might be here by the weekend so you never know 
On the other hand ....... I might make you all wait 'till I get back (only away for a week so its not too bad) 

Paula - you make a valid point re. poor food etc.  I have just had loads of my photos of our grandchildren out trying to compare and its hopeless - for starters there isn't a photo anywhere of any of of ours looking as sick and floppy as this baby - thank goodness.  And doesn't his raise another point - WHY subject a sick child to a photographic session?  Your point about it possibly being a first birthday portrait of one of the older children - they were a poor family, no cash to spare, and I wouldnt think they were in the habit of marking the kids birthdays by a photographs particularly with such a poorly looking one.  I have no positively identified photographs at all of this branch of the family - that is if it IS this side of the family. 

Isn't it intriguing?  Its great to read all the different opinions - I wonder who gets the prize?