GERMANY: Familienbucher Oberrosbach v.d. Höhe & Grüningen look up offer

[sunnyblueskies]

Hi there, just stumbled across this forum because I was looking for information out of the book 'Familienbuch fuer Grueningen.

Are you still available for this?
Johann Nicolaus Weidenhausen born jan 1722 in Gruening, he married a Anna Elisabeth Henkel also from Grueningen.
I'm mainly interested in the previous generations. Are there many generations of Weidenhausen? Or only 1 or two? Where did the come from etc.
Thanks.
P.S.: Is the book about Grueningen still available to buy somewhere?

[JenClark]

Hi there Sunnyblueskies...welcome to Rootschat!

I am so sorry for the delay in replying, for some reason I did not get a notification of your post.

In answer to your queries, yes I am more than happy to check the copy of the Grüningen familienbucher I have for your names, but, no I don't believe that it is available for purchase anymore. Though I would love to find one myself, as I only have a photocopy! It was originally published in 1990, you may be able to locate one in a library depending on where you live though.

I descend from the Weidenhausen/Weydenhausen family from Grüningen myself, and the records of this family in the familienbuch date back to the mid 1600's.

I am very happy to say that I have found your ancestor

Johann Nicolaus Weidenhausen was born 6 Jan 1722 in Grüningen to Johann Adam Weidenhausen and Elisabetha Heller, he was the fifth of their 8 children. His father Johann Adam Weidenhausen was married twice, and had a total of 13 children all up...though not many lived to adulthood.

Johann Adam Weidenhausen - born 29 Nov 1675, died 27 Feb 1735
First marriage: 21 Jan 1705
First wife: Anna Catharina Leydich - born 9 May 1686, died 18 Apr 1712
Children:
1. Johann Caspar Weidenhausen - born 14 Feb 1706, died 21 Jun 1709
2. Anna Margretha Weidenhausen - born 4 Nov 1708, died 28 Nov 1710
3. Anna Maria Weidenhausen - born 8 Aug 1710, died 24 Jan 1759
4. Johann Zacharias Weidenhausen - born 20 Dec 1711, died 1 Mar 1735 (twin)
5. Johannes Weidenhausen - born 20 Dec 1711, died 13 Jan 1712
Second marriage: 18 Mar 1713
Second wife: Elisabetha Heller - born 1687, died 30 May 1747
Children:
1. Johann Peter Weidenhausen - born 4 Feb 1714
2. Anna Gertrauda Weidenhausen - born 13 Jan 1715, died 11 Dec 1789
3. Johannes Weidenhausen - born 30 Mar 1717
4. Catharina Weidenhausen - born 20 Apr 1719
5. Johann Nicolaus Weidenhausen - born 6 Jan 1722
6. Johann Balthasar Weidenhausen - born 16 May 1724, died 2 May 1808
7. Johann Zacharias Eberhard Weidenhausen - born 22 Nov 1726, died 16 May 1787
8. Anna Margaretha Weidenhausen - born 8 Dec 1729, died 18 Dec 1729

Usually when there are no burial details in the familienbuch it means that the person moved away from Grüningen, is this the case with your Johann Nicolaus Weidenhausen?

There are details in the book for the families of his brothers Johann Balthasar Weidenhausen, and Johann Zacharias Weidenhausen, but nothing for your fellow.

Let me know when you receive this information ok, and I will transcribe the details for the earlier generations for you. There is information for Johann Adam Weidenhausen's parents; Johann Jacob  Weydenhausen & Elisabetha Metter (or Gilbert), and for his grandparents Reichhard & Anna Elisabetha Weidenhausen. I also descend from this couple.....so we are very distantly related 

I can also see an entry for Elisabetha Heller's parents Johann Peter Heller & Catharina Marsteller.

At this stage I cannot see any entries in the familienbucher for Henkel, are you sure Anna Elisabeth Henkel was born in Grüningen? Do you have a bith date for her?

Glad I can help with the Weidenhausen's at least!

Jenny

[sunnyblueskies]

Hi distant relative. So nice to hear from you!!!

Through online familiy trees I was able to get some information up to Johann Jacob W. and Elisabeth Meder. Don't know if it's correct or not, because I can't look it up at Archion in Grueningen churchbooks. Do you know if any Churchbooks of Grueningen are online?
For Johann Peter Heller I have birth and death date, but not where he was born or his parents.
For Catharina Marsteller I have more through Marsteller geneology available, but not her mother?

Anna Elisabeth Henkel supposedly died in Grueningen on 27 jan 1797? Her parents are Johann Henrich Henkel (1689 - 1754) died in Wetter, Marburg area.
His wife was from Ockershausen, Anna Maria (Margarethe) Orthwein, born 1700 in Ockershausen. There is more available for her through the 'Marburger Sippenbuch' on Genwiki.

What do you know about the generations of Weidenhausen prior to Johann Jacob? Would love to find out.

[JenClark]

Hello again, lovely to have connected with you 

I saw your tree on Ancestry, and I can see that you already have the detail from the Grüningen familienbucher. The author's of the online family trees you mentioned must have had access to the book. The Grüningen familienbucher covers the period from 1647-1900, so it does not go back further than Johann Nicolaus Weidenhausen's grandparents, Reichhard & Anna Elisabetha Weidenhausen, who I see are in your tree. They are the first Weidenhausen family in the book. I suspect that they were from Grüningen, but that cannot be confirmed.

The book simply states the below for the couple:

Reichhard Weidenhausen - "ohne Angaben" meaning "without details"
Wife: Anna Elisabetha - "ohne Angaben" meaning "without details"
Children:
1. Johann Jacob Weidenhausen - born 9 Dec 1646, died 27 May 1722 (your ancestor)
2. Johann Wilhelm Weidenhausen - born 22 Dec 1650, died 23 Oct 1729 (my ancestor)

The book states the below for your fellow, it does not give any other details:

Johann Jacob Weydenhausen - born 9 Dec 1646, died 27 May 1722
Marriage: 13 Nov 1673
Wife: Elisabeth Metter (or Gilbert?) - born 1648, died 25 Dec 1734
Children:
1. Johann Adam Weydenhausen - born 29 Nov 1675, died 27 Feb 1735
2. Johann Wilhelm Weydenhausen - born 12 Mar 1679, died 11 Nov 1729
3. Johann Jacob Weydenhausen - born 18 ? 1681, died 19 Nov 1713
4. Anna Margretha Weydenhausen - born 19 Mar 1684, died 2 Mar 1760
5. Johannes Weydenhausen - born 26 Aug 1687, died 11 Sep 1760
6. Johann Nicolaus Weydenhausen - born 19 Feb 1690, died 15 Jan 1742

So it looks like all the children lived to adulthood and remained in Grüningen. Are you also following the other lines down?

You are correct, Archion.net does not yet have any church books for Grüningen, but the LDS Church have filmed some, there are films back to the 1600's, but only 1810 onwards appear to be available online in any capacity. So too late to check the supposed death of Anna Elisabeth Henkel in 1797.

From looking at the Grüningen familienbucher I would say that she was definitely not born in Grüningen. I would also think that as the family is not mentioned in the Grüningen familienbucher neither she nor Johann Nicolaus Weidenhausen died there, or had children there.

I have got to pop out now, but I will type up the details for the Heller/Marsteller family later

Jenny

[JenClark]

The entry in the Grüningen familienbucher for your Heller family, is as per your tree on Ancestry.

It states:

Johann Peter Heller - born May 1654, died 11 Jun 1730 - "ohne herkunftsangabe" meaning "without indication of origin"
married: 7 Apr 1681
Wife: Catharina Marsteller - born 10 Apr 1658, died 10 Mar 1732
Children:
1. Catharina Heller - born 14 Sept 1684
2. Johannes Heller - born 8 May 1690, died 27 Oct 1762
3. Gertraud Heller - born 1693, died 4 Apr 1771
4. Johann Zacharias Heller - born 6 Mar 1696, died 7 Dec 1782
Nachtrag: meaning "addendum" or "supplement"
5. Elisabetha Heller - born 1687, died 30 May 1747
6. Anna Maria Heller - born 1682, died 21 Mar 1759

I can only imagine that the "added" daughters, including your Elisabetha, do not feature in the baptisms, but named Johann Peter Heller & Catharina Marsteller as their parents at the time of their death or marriage??

I descend from a Heller family in Grüningen, but a different line, so perhaps our families link there as well

I also descend from your Metter and Marsteller families.......I sometimes think I am related to everyone in Grüningen one way or another 

Catharina Marsteller's family is below, it is the first Marsteller family in the book. You will note that there isn't a date for their marriage in the book, but I see you have a date in your tree.

Johann Wilhelm Marsteller - born 1626, died 6 May 1702 - "ohne herkunftsangabe" meaning "without indication of origin"
Wife: Maria - born 1631, died 14 Mar 1712 - "ohne herkunftsangabe" meaning "without indication of origin"
Children:
1. Johann Zacharias Marsteller - born 7 Aug 1653, died 9 Jan 1726 (my ancestor)
2. Johann Peter Marsteller - born 23 Sept 1655
3. Anna Catharina Marsteller - born 10 Apr 1658, died 10 Mar 1732 (your ancestor)
4. Johann Jacob Marsteller - born 29 Jan 1660, died 13 Oct 1739 (also my ancestor)
5. Barbara Catharina Marsteller - born 5 Jun 1664, died 22 Sept 1738
6. Johann Balthasar Marsteller - born 31 Jan 1669, died 19 Aug 1750

Your Metter family is also as per your Ancestry tree:

Balthasar Metter (also Meder) - died 22 Feb 1675
wife: Anna Margretha - "keine angaben" meaning "no information provided"
Children:
1. Elisabeth Metter - born 27 Feb 1648 (NB - her death is not recorded in this family entry)
2. Johann Adan Metter - born 15 Sept 1650, died 19 Mar 1706 (my ancestor)
3. Catharina Metter - born 7 Aug 1653
4. Johann Cloß Metter - born 20 Mar 1658, died 12 Nov 1709
5. Zacharias Metter - born 27 Jan 1661
6. Johann Wilhelm Metter - born 24 Aug 1662
7. Johannes Metter - born 16 Feb 1668, died 15 Apr 1731
8. Anna Margarethe Metter - born 1655, died 18 Apr 1717 (I am not sure why she is listed last)

There is also a note stating:
"Vorseitig genannter Balthasar Meder war Consul (= Bürgermeister) 1651 laut Glockeninschrift Grüningen"
which translates to:
Balthasar Meder mentioned above was consul (= mayor) 1651 according to the bell inscription Grüningen

I hope that helps verify the information in your family tree 

Jenny 

[sunnyblueskies]

Oh awesome. Yes it verifies some of the dates etc. I'm usually cautions adding information simply from other online family trees and taking the names and dates for granted, but at times when I hit a brick wall, it's really the only thing one can do.

I have a part of my family coming from one village and yes it seems everyone is related somehow. =)

At this point I'm just working on 'going back' through the generations, not so much forward. Except if the information has already been researched and is available through birthcertificates etc. online.
Do you have any secrets on how you approach your research once you hit a brickwall and can't find anymore information? Like what do we do with the Weidenhausen line since we can't go any further back then Reichard? 

[JenClark]

Hi sunnyblueskies,

Glad the book could confirm the information in the online trees for you. I also work to confirm everything that I find in online trees, as there are so many mistakes circulating around! Hopefully the Grüningen church books will become available on Archion.net at some point in the near future so that we can see the actual entries....fingers crossed 

Genealogical information prior to the mid 1600's is extremely hard to find unless you were from a wealthy family, and I do not think that our Grüningen family were....there is the reference to Balthasar Metter/Meder being a Mayor in Grüningen in 1651, so the local historical societies may have more information on him I guess if you wanted to chase that. I visited Grüningen back in 2006 and the Mayor at the time showed me around, he was very pleased to be welcoming me to the town. So many people from the village left and settled in other countries, he treated me like a long lost daughter! My Marsteller family left Grüningen in the 1850's for Australia, when did your family leave? Are you researching from Canada/America?

The vast majority of German churchbooks do not have any information prior to the 30 year war (1618-1648), but I can see that you are already aware of this from your posts in the Archion.net forum.

https://www.archion.de/de/forum/?tx_mmforum_pi1%5Btopic%5D=12337&tx_mmforum_pi1%5Baction%5D=show&tx_mmforum_pi1%5Bcontroller%5D=Topic&cHash=271d25492e861204fcb62c22678f24dd

To be honest, I am pretty chuffed that I can trace my German family back to the 1600's....that is no mean feat. We might just have to be satisfied with that for our Grüningen ancestors 

I have attached a photo from my trip, so you can see Grüningen too...the church is in the centre of the picture 

Jenny

[sunnyblueskies]

Wow, thanks for the picture. That would have been neat to visit the town/village and have somebody show you around.
No I'm not such an old emigrated family. I personally emigrated about 25 years ago, but I also haven't been back in that long. Still have some family there but they are not as invested into genealogy. Seems like one is more interested in the past when one is removed from the area?
Did you visit the town of Weidenhausen too? I haven't found out yet what the relation between the town and the name is. But since we come from peasants and tradespeople I figure we once belonged to the place. =)
Yes I'm in Canada now. =)

[JenClark]

No I didn't get to Weidenhausen....I have a few surnames in my German family that are also town names....and yes I suspect as you do that we once belonged to those places.

And yes, you are probably right, people tend to be more interested in the past if their families left an area rather than if they stayed.

Good luck with the rest of your research