Howard Family

[Corky44]

I am researching the Howard family from Partington in Cheshire. (Census information states the family were from Partington/Disley and Poynton areas)James Howard was born in 1847, his father was Joseph Howard. According to family information, James Howard worked at Dunham Massey, a Stately Home in the early 1870's. Towards the mid 1870's James moved to the Liverpool area and married Christina Pennington. James worked as a carter and rumour has it he used to stop at every pub along the Dock Road in Liverpool, leaving his horse and cart waiting outside for him. James and Christina had several children,Christina, born in 1877, Thomas,1878, Harriet,1879, Margaret, 1883 and Frederick born in 1888. The family lived in the Bootle area for many years, if anyone has any information could you please get in touch.

[Reiver]

Hello Corky
As someone who lives near to Partington and to the Hall at Dunham Massey I have been looking at where I can help.

You mention that Census Returns provide places of birth for James of Partington, Disley and Poynton.  I know that people do vary their places of birth - often giving either the parish or the township.  However, and you may know this,  Partington and Disley/Poynton are miles apart - the latter rwo are slightly nearee to one another.

Is it on the marriage cerificate of James and Christina Pennington that James' father is given as Joseph?

Regards
Reiver

[Corky44]

Hi

Thanks for the reply.  Up until a couple of weeks ago I hadn't been able to identify the name of James's father.  I received James and Christina's marriage certificate last week and it gives his father as Joseph Howard.  I do seem to recall many years ago, my mother telling me that my grandfathers family were from Partington, the only reason I mention Disley/Poynton was because one of the census records showed these areas.  I have just rechecked 3 census records, 1881, states he was born in Manchester, 1891 and 1901 both state he was born in Partington.  Any help much appreciated

[Reiver]

Hello Corky
I had found them on the 1881 Census in Bootle but was confused that I wasn't finding a marriage on FreeBMD between a James Howard and a Christine Pennington - or similar - in the mid 1870s as you said.   I noted also that James and Christine had a son William aged 13 and three others aged 4. 3 and 1.   It would appear that Christine married firstly in 1865 and then married James, as you say, in 1874 when she was in fact Christine(a) Haslam.

Round about 1875 Partington, changed from Cheshire to Lancashire and hence into Manchester)  (Google Genuki Partington Cheshire).   When in Cheshire it was part of Bowdon - a very large parish - which included both Dunham Massey and Partington;

Before going on, have you found a possible James earlier than 1881?   I've found a possible candidate for him in 1851. 1861 and 1871 but in all three cases his father is NOT Joseph. 
I was wondering whether Joseph died between the time that James was born in 1846/1847 and 1851 when 'his' parents are apparently William and Mary.

Thought I'd pass this back to you for any thoughts.

I'll let you know chapter and verse if you wish.

Regards
Reiver

[Corky44]

Hi

Yes, you are right, Christina had been married before she married James Howard.  When I first started researching my Howard relatives, I thought that James was the son of William and Mary but then I received the marriage certificate which has totally confused me.  I suppose it could be possible that James did lose his father at an early age.  I seem to recall a story back in the 1970's that his mother was not married when he was born but no-one has been able to confirm this.  Any thoughts or information you have would be greatfully received.
Thanks

[Reiver]

I think what happened is as follows - but you will need to confirm the details initially anyway from the Marriage Certificate you have.

Sometime in the period Jun to September 1874 James Howard married Christina Haslam.  I think you will find this surname mentioned on the certificate you have.

However I believe Christina Ellen Pinnington - she is Christina E, if I remember on one of the post 1881 Censuses - married a John Haslam in the June to September period  of 1865.  I think that this will be your Christina.  If so it suggests that James was happy to give his own surname to William in the 1881 Census and call him his son.  Does your certificate include any reference to Haslam?  If not it could well be that I am  up a gum tree 

You say that James' father is Joseph from the Certificate.  Is there any indication that he was deceased?  What was his occupation?   Were any other Howards shown as witnesses?

Regards
Reiver

[Corky44]

Hi

Thanks for the information about Christina's first marriage.  You mention that William Haslam took James Howards surname, I noticed in a later census that William had reverted back to using the surname Haslam.
The marriage of James Howard to Christina took place on 13th July 1874 in the Parish Church, Liverpool.  The witnesses are listed as Emma Roberts Metcalf and Frederic Wurst.  James Howard's occupation is shown as a Carter and his father Joseph Howard's occupation is listed as the same.  Christina is shown as Christina E Haslam

[Reiver]

Hello Corky
I may have found James earlier but there are a number of question marks.

In Liverpool in 1881 he said he was 34 and born in Manchester.  He had married in 1874 and said his father was Joseph.  In subsequent censuses he said he was born in Partington.  You will know that Manchester is the nearest 'big' town to Partington.  But before 1974 Partington was in Cheshire.   In 1870 the Manchester Ship Canal had not been built and Partington was just over a mile's walk from Sinderland - of which more in a minute.  Sinderland is just over a mile from Dunham Town - the hamlet just outside the grounds of Dunham Hall.   In fact Sinderland is a hamlet within the township of Dunham Massey.  All are in the parish of Bowdon.

The major problem is I cannot find a James Howard with a father called Joseph.

However you mentioned in your first post that family records say that James worked at Dunham Hall in the 1870s.  In 1871 there is a 25 yr old James Howard, a Farm Servant, living at 9, Sinderland Lane in Dunham with a family headed by a Joseph and Mary Dawson. The Dawson children were there plus a domestic servant and other farm servants.

Ten years earlier at Back Lane - also in Dunham Massey - there is a 17yr old James Howard living with his younger brother Samuel and their parents William and Mary Howard.  The whole family were born in Dunham.  James was an Ag Lab like his father. William was aged 44 and Mary aged 41.

Could a 17yr old in 1851 be a 34 yr old in 1881??  This James' father is William not Joseph.

In 1851 the Howard family are in the hamlet of Sinderland - nearer Partington???

I tried another avenue looking for Joseph Howard in this particular area with no luck.  However the Tithe Apportionments - mid 1840s - show a William Howard as an occupier of property in the township of Partington.

I've not included sources here but will if you ask.

Maybe another Rootschatter can add to or correct this 

Regards
Reiver

[Corky44]

Hi

I have just spoken to my aunt to see if she could provide any further information.  She has but it has really confused me.  She told me that her grandfather, James Howard, was definitely born in Partington in 1847 but the family were always told that he was illegitimate.  She went on to explain that this story was circulated to the family in the 1940's but no-one had ever been able to find out if it was true.  One theory was that James actually took his mothers maiden name, but again this has never been proven.  I explained that I have received a copy of his marraige certificate which gives his father's name as Joseph Howard.  My aunt does not believe that James's father was Joseph Howard.  Help!!  Where do I go from here?  My aunt is in her 90's and doesn't seem to remember any other information.