Henry O'Neill/O'Neil born Oldham 1883

[emmsthheight]

Hi again.

Heywood, sorry but am I being a bit slow here, do I gather the Elizabeth Henry meeried was Elizabeth Rourke, on the GRO?

Probably just me being slow!

Emms

[heywood]

more like me probably going off at a tangent - the first post says that Henry (who is being searched for) is the son of Henry O'Neill and Elizabeth Rouke.
You found (probably) Henry snr in Back Dawes Street in 1871 and I found a possible Lizzie Rourke in 1871.
I also posted their marriage to support the Bolton v Oldham argument. 

[heywood]

Lancashire BMD has Henry born Oldham - mother's name Rorke -  it does seems a bit odd the Bolton/Oldham connections.

[emmsthheight]

Hi, no it's me.

Must be the heat!  I thought I'd checked right back to the top and I evidently hadn't!

Emms

[li91mo]

Hi again

Thanks to both of you for your help on this.  I had already found Henry Snr and Elizabeth's marriage index and have ordered a certificate.  Should be here next week.  But I think that you two have probably found the right couple on the cenuses.  The certifcate will hopefully confirm it.

The Lizzie Rourke sounds like it could be Elizabeth too.

I suppose it is possible that Henry Jnr just happened to be born in Oldham, when his family was based in Bolton, they are not a million miles away.  He certainly spent most of his later life in Bolton.  Maybe later on they just said he was born in Bolton as he never lived in Oldham.

The only thing that I have doubts about is the 1901 entry for Henry Junior and his wife and son. The census says he is 26 but he should be only 17.  And strange that the mention of Oldham is back.  Also we know that his second wife (married 1919) raised some of his children, so I was thinking he married for a first time later.  Henry Jnr served in the Royal Engineers, so perhaps he was abroad and not included on the 1901 census. 

Most of my other relations have fairly unusal surnames and so posed a lot less of a problem tracking down!  Extremely grateful for all your help.

[emmsthheight]

Hi

Yes, I see what you mean, and actually I should have looked again, as that's the first one I looked at, so I started in Oldham.

There's at least one possibility in Bolton.

This one still has very young children for the father Henry snr, if it's them and not sure of the ages.  henry jnr isn't with them if it's them.

RG13/3626
Bolton,
Bolton le Moors, Holy Trinty,

T's Yard
Henry O'Neil (47, Blacksmith's lab'r?0 and Lizzie (32)

with daughters, Lily(6), Ethel(3) and Alice 6m.

Notsure

Will look again.

Emms

[emmsthheight]

Hi

FullBMD Images has:

Birth 1883, Oc-Dec
O'Neil, Henry, Oldham, 8d 607

Only Henry O'Neil(l).

Will check the other dates later.

Haven't checked O'Neal(l) for any of it.

Emms

[heywood]

Lancashire BMD has a marriage for Henry O'Neill and Sarah Rogerson 1899 Oldham St James.
Can't see a death for a Sarah between 1901 and 1919.

Am I right that you think that Henry and Sarah of 1901 may not be the ones you need? If there were older children as you say from his first marriage - do you know the names and could you get a birth certificate for one of them?
This may narrow the search.
best wishes
heywood

[li91mo]

Hi again

Thanks again for all your help, you are all most helpful!  I think that although he was born in Oldham, I think Bolton is the place to look for.

Yes Emms, that is the correct Birth Index for Henry, I order a copy and that is how I found out that his parents were Henry O'Neill and Elizabeth Rourke.  Their marriage certificate should be on its way now.  Once I get it I can check their ages against the possible census ages you have both found.

We know very little about Henry Jnr and about the children he had from his previous marriage.  We know there was definitely a boy, but we think there were more. No idea of their year of birth or their names.

Henry Jnr married for a second time in 1919 in Bolton.  His second wife raised the children form his first marriage, that is why I was not expecting to see him with children on the 1901 Census as they would be too old by 1919 to need to be raised by the second wife. 

Do either of you know anything about searching military records?  As I know he served in the Royal Engineers.

Anyway all your help is much appreciated