Author Topic: 1851 census Essex - 61st Regiment of Foot Soldiers  (Read 8181 times)

Offline Valda

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Re: 1851 census Essex - 61st Regiment of Foot Soldiers
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 06 November 05 18:52 GMT (UK) »
Census night 1871 was April 2nd.
You have all the details I could find on the 1851 census. Because this James was not with his regiment, the census does not show which regiment he was in and I don't know whether the 61st was stationed at Chatham in 1851. This James was a private not a sergeant. He would have to have had a meteoric rise to have made sergeant by 1853. However men did rise and fall in the ranks, courtmartialled for things like drunkeness and if he had previously made sergeant he could have quickly returned to that rank again or he could indeed have been an exceptional soldier.

As you know your James' regiment and that he did receive a pension, it will be perfectly possible to find his army attestation papers at The National Archives, which would give you more details about him. You could also follow him through the quarterly muster rolls for the 61st.
I would read the research guides that the National Archives supply on their website before your visit.

http://www.catalogue.nationalarchives.gov.uk/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=14

http://www.catalogue.nationalarchives.gov.uk/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=16

http://www.catalogue.nationalarchives.gov.uk/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=15

The help desks at The National Archives are staffed by very informative and helpful people but obviously if you know what you are looking for, you will be able to help them to help you and so you will get the most out of your visit.

The army wasn't fussy about the age of men who enlisted or much else about them. Men were frequently a little vague about their age and boys would just adjust their age up a little. The army was not in the habit of asking questions. If your James enlisted as early as 1840 (when he could have been as old as 25) then by 1861 he would have served 21 years and be eligible for pension.
If James was in India then other children could have been born and possibly died in India (have you looked in the overseas births?). If he was indeed in India then he would have been there through the Indian Mutiny 1857-1858. His attestation papers and the muster rolls together will tell you where he was stationed - in the case of the muster rolls every quarter each year.

This website gives an extremely detailed account of the 61st in India through the time of the mutiny listing the names of casualties (James does not seem to be mentioned)

http://members.tripod.com/~Glosters/index-4.html

The website says the 61st left India in July 1860. In which case the whole regiment should have been in England for the 1861 census and James earlier if you have a birth in this country for one of his children in 1859.
You don't give any details about James' wife and children, so I can't really help search for them on the 1861 census without some further information.

Regards
Valda
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline katarina

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Re: 1851 census Essex - 61st Regiment of Foot Soldiers
« Reply #10 on: Sunday 06 November 05 19:02 GMT (UK) »
Thank you very much for the info about the National Archives at Kew, I'm going there on the 26th Nov for the whole day and although I will have to have an induction tour I hope I will enough time to find out something of James' military record.

1861 census - Here is who to look for ie James and family

James Kilroy- Head- age 48/46 born ??
Honor Kilroy - Wife- age 29/30 born in Barrow Suffolk (b.1832)
William Kilroy-son- age 2 born in Barrow Suffolk (b.1859)

If you do get a chance to see if you can find them well i would be over the moon. I really do appreciate your help Valda.

Many thanks

Katarina

ROBERTSON- Glasgow, Bathgate, Newburgh, Abdie, Abernethy, St Madoes.<br />MALCOLM/CONSTABLE- Abernethy, Dunning.<br />FORSYTH/COWAN- Glasgow, Cathcart.<br />FOTHERINGHAM/PATON/PITKETHLY-Newburgh, Abernethy.<br />BISSLAND/MILLER- New/East Kilpatrick, Glasgow.<br />BARLOW- Lancashire, Glasgow.<br />MITCHELL/JOHNSTON- Buchanan, New/East Kilpatrick.<br />KILROY- London, MIddx/Balinrobe Mayo <br />KAVANAGH/NORTON-Dublin Eire

Offline Valda

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Re: 1851 census Essex - 61st Regiment of Foot Soldiers
« Reply #11 on: Sunday 06 November 05 20:11 GMT (UK) »
I presume you have the family from the 1871 census, but just in case I think this is them

RG10 338 folio 19
1 Brunswick Mews St George Bloomsbury  London
Honora Kilroy 36 Barrow, Suffolk, Head Widow Mangle
William Kilroy 12 Barrow, Suffolk, Son 
Richard Kilroy 8  Bloomsbury, St George, Middlesex, Son 
Appolonia Kilroy 6 Bloomsbury, St George, Middlesex, Daughter

The name looks much more like Kimoy. I can't find them on the 1861 census i'm afraid.

Regards
Valda   
 

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline katarina

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Re: 1851 census Essex - 61st Regiment of Foot Soldiers
« Reply #12 on: Monday 07 November 05 09:32 GMT (UK) »
Valda,

Thank you very much for taking a look for me at the census returns.  I wonder where the kilroys went during the 1861 census - the mind boggles. I have found descendants of James kilroy with surname written as Kibroy, Gilroy, Kebroy and all sorts!

Well roll on the 26th and fingers crossed that I find something on this elusive ancestor at National Archives.

Kind regards

katarina
ROBERTSON- Glasgow, Bathgate, Newburgh, Abdie, Abernethy, St Madoes.<br />MALCOLM/CONSTABLE- Abernethy, Dunning.<br />FORSYTH/COWAN- Glasgow, Cathcart.<br />FOTHERINGHAM/PATON/PITKETHLY-Newburgh, Abernethy.<br />BISSLAND/MILLER- New/East Kilpatrick, Glasgow.<br />BARLOW- Lancashire, Glasgow.<br />MITCHELL/JOHNSTON- Buchanan, New/East Kilpatrick.<br />KILROY- London, MIddx/Balinrobe Mayo <br />KAVANAGH/NORTON-Dublin Eire


Offline Ian Spelman

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Re: 1851 census Essex - 61st Regiment of Foot Soldiers
« Reply #13 on: Sunday 09 December 12 13:48 GMT (UK) »
Hello, did you have any luck with your rearch into the soldier relative do you have an army number for him?
IAN

Offline katarina

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Re: 1851 census Essex - 61st Regiment of Foot Soldiers
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 24 October 13 12:22 BST (UK) »
Hello once again,
It's been a long time but i'm back and would like to say a very big thank you to all that have replied and helped me find details of James Kilroy. 
I know have his military record from the National Archives and i couldn't have done that without your help, so again a very big thank you to you!

I can now say that this query is now closed.

All the very best in your research

Kat  ;D
ROBERTSON- Glasgow, Bathgate, Newburgh, Abdie, Abernethy, St Madoes.<br />MALCOLM/CONSTABLE- Abernethy, Dunning.<br />FORSYTH/COWAN- Glasgow, Cathcart.<br />FOTHERINGHAM/PATON/PITKETHLY-Newburgh, Abernethy.<br />BISSLAND/MILLER- New/East Kilpatrick, Glasgow.<br />BARLOW- Lancashire, Glasgow.<br />MITCHELL/JOHNSTON- Buchanan, New/East Kilpatrick.<br />KILROY- London, MIddx/Balinrobe Mayo <br />KAVANAGH/NORTON-Dublin Eire