Patrish Scavenger Hunt.....Everybody Welcome to Join In.

[patrish]

Reply 94#

Palmer  Susannah     London City  1c 167

Checked this on complete index's no cross reference for an Emmanuel Phillips.

Right
so  we know that  Abraham b 1856 is Emmanuels brother.

Abraham b 1799/1800 could be the brother of Philip Philips Emmanuels father.

he Abraham Phillips age 28 in 1881 = b. c1852/3, making him son of Samuel & Hannah

Got it now. 

[Brambletye]

Right
so  we know that  Abraham b 1856 is Emmanuels brother.

I'm lost now! I thought Abraham b. 1856 was Emanuel's son - did Emanuel also have an Emanuel?

Added: Samuel & Hannah had an Abraham 1852 and an Emanuel 1855, but I've only got an Abraham 1856 for Emanuel & Susan

[DebbieG]

I have found a Philip & Catherine in 1841 - I was dubious cos all the kids are wrong,  but if you think they are passing their children round  I will put it here so you can see it

1841  ST BOTOLPH WITHOUT ALDGATE

Phillip Phillips 40  tailor - foriegn
Catherine Phillips 35 
Elizabeth Phillips 16 
Godfrey Phillips 13 
John Phillips 6 
Nancy Phillips 4 
Rose Phillips 2 
Ann Phillips inft 
Lewis Raphael 23 
Catherine Calow 55 
Abraham Lee 25 
Jane Lee 65 
Joseph Lee 65 
Maria Lee 15 


Debbie

[patrish]

Oh boy this is the problem with so many same named generations.

1881 Census which I am sure is the right family.
 
Phillip Phillip head un 26 b Spitalfields, Middx. Cigar Maker
Susan mother widow 56 B Whitechapel
Abraham brother un 23 b Middx City Cigar Maker
Jacob brother un 21 b Middx City Cigar Maker
Isaac brother un 19 b Middx City, Tobacco Operator
Catherine sister un 17 b Middx City Tailoress.

[patrish]

I'm lost now! I thought Abraham b. 1856 was Emanuel's son - did Emanuel also have an Emanuel?

As of the 1871 no.

It was his son Jacob/John who had another Emmanuel my grandfather.

Dont think I have made this very clear.

There are as far as I now just 3 Emmanuels in total.

Emmanue lb 1828 who married Susan Palmer

Emmanuel b 1854 son of  Samuel and Hannah Levy

Emmanuel b 1889 (my grandfather)  son of Jacob/John and Emma Louisa Ayrton (My Gt. Grand parents.)

Is that somewhat clearer

[patrish]

I am not convinced      if it is them where are thier own children.

And those seem nicely spaced out at 2/3 year intervals as was the norm.

[cathayb]

oh lovely i wish i had more time to study it.need to run this hunt again sometime,there at last is a coonection to my jews.dear godfrey phillips.rember your naming pattern.try and write out 3 generations or 4 in rough.how many brothers called their sons after the grandad?then their granchildren were called after themselves.you should see quite a few names repeating themselves through every other generation.impossible to work out sensibly with out seeing it written.there was 1 marriage to a levy mentioned. the other levy witnesses may just be rabbis maembers of the synogue.just a pooibility.didnt a phillips male marry the levy woman?no name cahange there to be expected cause they named after male grandad.the children of the woman would not become part of the priestly line of levy even though jewish peranthood is traced through the women.heriditory is through the male..just to confuse you further if man dies his brother or one of them is expected to marry if possible the widow or at least take her and the kids into his home and care for her as is own.  cathay b

[Brambletye]

Got a visitor coming soon, I'll try and get back later - just to finish off with for now, remember the Caroline Phillips 1841 & her children, sharing a household with a Rebecca Phillips age 40 b. county and a Mary age 80 b. county? (HO107/710/3/45/18).

Rebecca was also a Fruiterer, same as Solomon (he of the weird address).

I wonder if Mary age 80 is the last surviving common link of the 1841 Phillips contingent, if we could find out anything about her?

[patrish]

Hi Cathyab 

I dont think Michael Phillips who married Abigail Martin is related to me.

Samuel I believe is.  His marriage was in the Great  Syngagoue Chamber, St. Lukes Place. according to the rites of the Jewish Religion.

Both used thier marks .

Witnesses :- Aaron Hendricks. Mark Mark, Simeon Oppanheimer  for the Gt. Synagogue    something  which I cannot read.

I am gonna take a break myself, brain is going round in circles.