Barron/Paterson *completed with thanks to Monica & Ellen*

[ellenbrora]

Aah, found it - may be a complete red herring but,

1861 Marnoch, Banffshire  (where the possible Jessie Paterson was born)

James Paterson, 15, General Servant, b. Huntly, Aberdeenshire

with Alexander Smith 83 and Jessie Smith 37.

I think I'm twisting the facts to suit myself here, but worth considering:  maybe James knew his father was in Huntly by this time and thought he was born there?? 

The James Barron/Barrow you have above is much more likely. This would mean that William Barron and James Barron snr should be brothers?  But William Barron is much too old to be the son of Robert and Margaret Barron. Could he be a grand nephew?

Hmmm - I'm off to sort out all we have so far and regroup - I think I'm going round in circles now - and I really should be getting ready to go out!

Cheers

Ellen.

[MonicaL]

Hi Ellen

It does take you round in circles this one doesn't it!

My thoughts on the 1851/61 entries with William as head. James shows as nephew in 1851 and grandson in 1861    Quite often grandparent passed off illegitimate grandchildren as 'nephew/niece' . By 1861 James is showing as grandchild so not sure what's what on that one.  There is a possible marriage for a William and Helen (McCurach) on 06 OCT 1831 Gamrie, so too late for them to have had a son James as father to James Jnr.

The 1871 entry with James as 'son' to Helen doesn't make sense either.  Can't see a marriage between a James Barron and a Helen Taylor (who shows as mother to Alexander on IGI ) but there is one for a James and a Mary Taylor showing on 14 NOV 1852 King Edward, Aberdeenand not sure if this is the same couple. The children Mary Jane and George are in Helen's household with James Jnr with Helen as mother....

Still no closer to sorting out who's who and even if we have have the correct Barrons - frustrating!

Monica 

[monkeymagik]

Hi Monica & Ellen, WOW!! you 2 work fast!! Thank you so much I did not expect a response like that!
I have a feeling the James Barron Son/Grandson/Nephew of William & Ellen is the correct James, but the relationship to head of family is the inconsistency I referred to in original post. I posted on Ancestry some time ago & a chap came back with this family also.
However so far I have been unable to confirm a connection with William or Ellen so cant be sure its the correct James. No clues on James Jnr's death record I was hoping a family member (brother/sister) had reged the death but it was just a medical attendant.

James Jnr is still recorded as a Rope & Sail maker in 1901 census living @ 21 Close of Fife Street, Banff( this is also where he lived when he died),  his place of birth is still recorded as Gamrie, so the 25 year old James (sail maker) in the 1871 Census seems to fit other than place of birth!!!!
Hmmm.  The really frustrating thing is not being able to confirm anything.

Thankyou again for your help,

(I hope my Barron family did not make you late Ellen!!!)

Nicola.

[MonicaL]

Hi Nicola and Ellen

Huuuge cyber scream    of frustration.  I found James Barron's, husband of Helen Taylor, death cert.  Death reported by son George....who didn't know the name of his grandparents, not even part of their names.....

I still haven't sorted in my head James b. c. 1845's early years, but I do think in all probability the 1871 census entry is his. Occupation fits as does age. The reason he is showing as son is down to him being son of James, Helen's husband. Not sure where James Snr was in 1871.

Helen Taylor died in 1879,. Father's name not known by James widower, mother Mary Robb:

1879   BARRON   HELEN       TAYLOR   F   49   OLD MACHAR   ABERDEEN CITY/ABERDEEN   168/02 0683

Maybe this entry:

HELEN TAYLOR  Christening:  24 APR 1828  Marnoch, Banff, Scotland
Parents: WILLIAM TAYLOR and MARY ROBB

James Snr. then moved to St Nicholas Aberdeen City. This is his 1881 entry:

James Barron    63, b. MacDuff
Helen Barron    25, mill worker, b. MacDuff (b. 06 SEP 1856 Gamrie)
George Barron    12, b. MacDuff

Address: 23 St. Andrew St, St Nicholas Aberdeen

And in 1891, still living in Aberdeen at 74 West North St Naiper Court, he shows living alone, age 78, general labourer. He died in 1896:

1896   BARRON   JAMES       76   ST NICHOLAS   ABERDEEN CITY/ABERDEEN   168/01 0371


As additional background, I found this entry for Helen, with James husband also away from home, in 1861.  Family name mis transcribed:

Helen Barion    30, Farm Serv Wife, b. Marnoch
William Barion    9, b. Marnoch
John Barion    7, b. MacDuff
Helen Barion    4, b. MacDuff
Alexander Barion 2, b. MacDuff
Mary J Barion    1 Mo, b. MacDuff (As Ellen posted, her birth shows mother as Mary Taylor?)

Address: No.14 xxx? MacDuff

Mary Jane b. 1861 or, more likely, one of the two George births in the 1860s would show place/date of birth of parents (this info was introduced into birth certs in the early 1860s). Going by the age of eldest son showing above would likely be 1851-2ish?. In the census of 1851, there is a James Barron, 26, unmarried, b. Gamrie and a farm servant working in Methlick Aberdeenshire.


So, after all that, where do I think we might be? I think we certainly have a strong possiblity for James Jnr's father. That 1871 census entry with James Jnr. in the household with Helen Taylor is key. Huge pity James Snr's parents' details are blank....

Regards.

Monica 

[MonicaL]

These are the details for William, who shows as uncle/grandfather to our target James Jnr in 1851/61:

To parents Alexander BARRON and Elizabeth MARR, married 21 OCT 1775 Marnoch, Banff, Scotland:

1. MARGARET BARON Birth: 07 NOV 1782/Christening: 11 NOV 1782 Gamrie, Banff, Scotland
2. ALEXANDER BARRON Birth: 28 MAY 1787/Christening: 28 MAY 1787 Gamrie, Banff, Scotland
3. ISOBEL BARRON Birth: 10 DEC 1791/ Christening: 26 DEC 1791 Gamrie, Banff, Scotland
4. WILLIAM BARRON  Birth: 10 JAN 1794/Christening: 17 JAN 1794 Gamrie, Banff, Scotland
5. GEORGE BARRON Birth: JUL 1796/ Christening: 25 JUL 1796 Gamrie, Banff, Scotland
6. THOMAS BARRAN Christening: DEC 1798 Gamrie, Banff, Scotland

Nicola, given these dates, William Barron's relationship could have that of great uncle or maybe even grandfather, although we only have details of his marriage to Helen McCulloch in 1831. His entry in 1841 seems to show only children from this marriage given their age. So, I', probably more inclined to go with great uncle as a relationship.

The above list of siblings as you know is not conclusive. There was for example a John Barron and Elizabeth McKay having children in Gamrie:

1   11/05/1817   BARRON   ALEXR   JOHN BARRON/ELIZ. MACKAY  Gamrie and Macduff   /BANFF   155/ 0020 0506   
2   19/09/1830   BARRON   JANE   JOHN BARRON/ELIZABETH MCKAY Gamrie and Macduff   /BANFF   155/ 0030 0356   
3   09/07/1828   BARRON   JOHN   JOHN BARRON/ELISABETH MACKAY Gamrie and Macduff   /BANFF   155/ 0030 0326


Regards.

Monica 

ADDED: There is a Pedigree Resource file on this family on Family search with submitter details included that might be worthwhile following up on.

[monkeymagik]

A great big  THANK YOU Monica & Ellen for all your help. Rootschat has some exceptionally kind/generous people as members. 
Thank You.
Nicola

[MaggieBarron]

I can't find a James Barron born c.1845 in my tree but I have many Barron's from Macduff! I have a Helen Barron, daughter of Alexander Barron & Elizabeth Marr, who died at 3 High Street, Macduff in 1901.

Alexander Barron & Elizabeth Marr (re. MonicaLels post below) were my great-x4 grandparents. They were the parents of the John Barron who married Elizabeth MacKay (my great-x3 grandparents).

In reference to several messages below, "Jessie" is a common nickname for Janet and Jane. Very very common!

The Robert & Margaret Barron mentioned several times...they are Robert Barron and his wife Margaret Paterson.

I'll look through the census stuff I have, but I know for certain I also have some of my Barron's living at Crook O'Ness as well!!

I'm sure they're all related - which makes me related to you!

Maggie Barron
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada

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[MaggieBarron]

Did you ever find out if your James Barron was related to Robert & Margaret Barron?

Maggie Barron
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada

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