Keith/Don/Lees family ancestors - COMPLETE

[TunjiLees]

Hello, I am looking for ancestors of maternal grandmother's parents Isabella Dempster Keith & Robert Roberson Don, and of my paternal grandfather, David Lees.


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I obtained the following information from my grandmother. She told me that her father had done extensive research on his genealogy, but sadly all records and research were lost in a fire 20 years ago...

All I have to go is what my grandmother remembers her parents telling her over 40 years ago, therefore my information may not be accurate.

Though I found ancestors of another ancestral line of mine on familysearch.org I have not been able to find any from this one. I am quite new to Geanology research and would greatly appreciate any help or orientation as regards to this. I do not live in Britain therefore I can only resort to internet sources.

   John Keith, b. craigie farm, tayport, fife
   + Isabella ?
   = Isabella Dempster Keith, b. (flass farm, by wormit, fife 4th February 1904)

   John Don
   + Euphemia ? (b. blebo craigs, fife)
   = Robert Roberson Don, (b. newport-on-tay, fife 14th June 1907)

   --->

   Robert Roberson Don
   + Isabella Dempster Keith
   = Robert Don
   = Jean Isobel Don (b. newport-on-tay, fife 10th May 1936) (my Grandmother)


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Of my paternal grandfather, I know next to nothing, and even the smallest help would be greatly appreciated. His name was David Lees and I believe he was born on the 30th Oct 1916. He lived in Kirkcaldy, Fife, most of his life but I do not think he was born there. He had a brother called William Lees also a sister. His mother may have been called Mary. His wife was called Jean McDonald Simpson (14 Jan 1924) (her grandfather was http://www.familysearch.org/eng/Search/igi/individual_record.asp?recid=500182850867 ).


I am greatfull for any help anyone can provide,

Thank you

[MonicaL]

Hi TunjiLees

In the period that you are initially looking at, you are going to need to look at some BMDs on the official pay to view site www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk.  IGI is great but for Scotland indexes stop around 1874-75.

For example, a search on Scotlands People (SP), brings up these marriages as possibilities:

1888   KEITH   JOHN   DEMPSTER   ISABELLA   FORGAN   /FIFE   431/00 0015

1894   DON   JOHN JAMES   BUTTERCASE   EUPHEMIA   CULTS   /FIFE   419/00 0001

I can't see the marriage for Robert Don and Isabella Keith, this may have been after 1932 and the cut off for on-line access to marriage images on SP. SP are about to introduce new searchable indexes for marriages up to 2006 which will let you order certs. for marriages post 1932 directly through the site.

Simlarly, the births of Robert Don and Isabella Keith are outside of the online viewing cut off for births on SP (1906) but from last week you can now search the birth indexes up to 2006 and order direct from SP. Their birth certs. would confirm parents names and include mothers' maiden names.

For your other line, David Lees, given that you have to confirm parents' names, I would also start with ordering his birth cert. which will provide you with this info, including the date of his parents' marriage (or his marriage cert for his parents' names).

You need to verify each stage as you work back. Your searches will (hopefully!) become easier on-line once you get another generation back 

Regards.

Monica

[MonicaL]

Working on the 1888 marriage for a John Keith and Isabella Dempster, this looks a possibility for them in the 1891 census:

John Keith    27, ploughman, b. Fife, Leuchars
Isabella Keith    24, b. Flisk, Fife
Mary Kirkcaldy Keith 1, b. St Andrews

Address: Balrymonth Cot House, St Andrews

This family in 1901:

John Keith    37, Coal Carter, , b. Fife, Leuchars
Isabella Keith    34, b. Flisk, Fife
Mary Keith    11b, St Andrews
Christina Keith 6, b. Fifeshire, Forgan

Address:  Flass Farm, forgan

Going by the above address in 1901, looks like it will turn out to be the right family 

Monica

[MonicaL]

For the 1894 marriage for Don, this looks like the family in 1901:

John J Don 31, blacksmith, b. Dundee Angus
Euphemia Don 31, b. Fife, Dairsie
James C Don 6, b. Fife, Newport

Address: James Square, Forgan Fife

Regards.

Monica

[TunjiLees]

Wow, thanks a lot for your help, it has allowed me to trace me ancestors further.

This research however, keeps on raising more questions and uncertainties, such as:


Is
GEORGE DEMPSTER + MARY KIRKALDY  http://www.rootschat.com/links/02uz/
the same couple as
GEORGE DEMPSTER + MARY KIRKCALDY
http://www.rootschat.com/links/02v0/

Is this
JAMES COOPER DON
http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/igi/individual_record.asp?recid=500198383084
definitely the same as the father of
http://www.rootschat.com/links/02v1/
Also, some ancestors are easy to find when they have uncommon names. For example, ancestors of the Dons and Keiths are much harder to find than that of Buttercase or Dempster.


Also, do you know where/how can I acquire a copy David Lees' birth certificate? Thank you.

[MonicaL]

Hi TunjiLees

Questions always arise from research    This was my point about having to verify your research along the way by obtaining census and key birth/marriage/death certs to enable you to confirm events and people names etc.  The IGI is only one of a useful number of research tools. It's easy to make mistakes and go down the wrong path if you don't verify the detail, specially the further back you go.

Picking up on a couple of your points. Firstly, the Dempster side and the spelling of Kirk/c/aldy. You will find a huge range of spelling variations on both surnames and first names. In Scotland, specially the further back you go you will also come across the use of interchangeable first names (Ann/Agnes/Nancy - Peter/Patrick - Jane/Jean - Janet/Jessie to name a few). The IGI is very good at picking up on some spelling variations - but it is not 100%.

In respect of the Dons, you will only be certain that you have the right line by confirming the names from either the birth or marriage certs along the way.

Scottish resources are fantastic. The ability to view BMDs on line through Scotlands People at very reasonable costs greatly enhances the research.  For example for £6GB (minimum purchase of units), you are able to search (£0.20 - 1 unit) and view (£1.00 - 5 units) the image on line of a census entry or certificate. You can then save the image on to your computer and print off as required.

At this stage it would be worthwhile you starting out with viewing perhaps the marriage and birth certs for the key people you have, and having the info that you need from these certs., then looking at the censuses and IGI for further info to support what you are finding.

There are a number of useful guides here on RootsChat:

www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,43916.0.html
www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,24468.0.html
www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,193879.0.html

In respect of David Lees, as I mentioned yesterday, you can look at the new on-line indexes at SP which will  let you search for his birth and you can then order the cert directly via SP online.

Regards.

Monica

[TunjiLees]

Ok so my grandfather is:
-David Lees,  B. 30 Oct 1919 dysart, fife, scotland. Son of William Lees (a blacksmith) and Helen Lees : (Currie). However there is no date or place of birth listed for either...

[MonicaL]

Not sure what your source is for this info for David Lees.  However, if you have this info re David Lees parents with his mother's name now as Helen, then you should be able to look up their marriage on SP. There is only one marriage showing for a couple with their names:

1913   LEES   WILLIAM   CURRIE   HELEN   KIRKCALDY AND ABBOTSHALL   /FIFE   442/00 0146

This certificate will give you their ages, William's occupation and parents' names, including their mothers' maiden names to then let you work back....

There is a birth showing also on the indexes for another David in the same place as the above marriage which may be connected:

1915   LEES   DAVID RAMSAY   M   KIRKCALDY AND ABBOTSHALL   /FIFE   442/00 0187

Regards.

Monica

[TunjiLees]

Thanks again.

No Scotlands People for me until my credit card is reactivated I'm afraid...

In the mean time I managed to get in touch with my uncle in Kirkcaldy, and he sent me that information from David Lees's birth certificate.
He also told me that William Lees and Helen Currie had several children:
-William
-Thomas
-David (my grandfather)
-June

David Ramsay could possibly be another child named David, but I have no idea if that is true... Though if my uncle knew of him then he would have mentioned him to me as well.