Frank and George Cardwell

[cheshiremog]

1817 Residence 30 Baker Street Doncaster

Tom Cardwell Head Mar 35 Engine Fitter b Yorks Leeds
Emma Cardwell Wife Mar 36 b. Doncaster
George H  Cardwell 13
Alice 9
John T 7
Agnes 5
Arthur 3
Lorra 1
Frank 1mo
John Cardwell Father 65 Coachbody Maker b. Yorks, Wakefield

All children are sons or daus, all born Doncaster

But where is William Cardwell father of Edward Cardwell born 1895 ??

[cheshiremog]

Sorry one above should read 1871!

1861 explains more:-

1861 - Res- West St. James Street Doncaster
Tom Cardwell Hd Mar 25 Engine Erector?
Emma  Wife  26
Emily dau 7
George H son 3
Lilley dau 8 mos
Mother and all children b. Doncaster

1861- Res - No 13 Mill ?  Street, Doncaster
John Cardwell Head 56 Coach maker Journeyman b. Wakefield
Mary Ann Cardwell wife 55 b.Notts Newark
Elizabeth Cardwell dau unm 23 Gen Serv b. Leeds
Emma Cardwell dau unm 20 Gen Serv b. Leeds
Cornelius Cardwell  Son unm 18 Labourer Ind b. Sheffield
Arthur Cardwell son 16 Apprentice Moulder b. Sheffield
William H Cardwell SON 1 b. Doncaster
Sarah A Palfreyman Nurse-child 3 mos b. Doncaster

Very interesting - I would be surprised if William H Cardwell was the son of Mary Ann aged 55 ! There is a 'nurse child' in the house - have not seen this before ?  Which of the females were 'nursing' her - if that's what it means - was William H the son of John & Mary ? Or was he the son of Tom & Emma  and should have been listed as a grand son ?  Or was he maybe the son of one of the daughters - Elizabeth or Emma and to save embarrasment he was listed as a son rather than grandson? As William H was born 1859 you should be able to get his birth certificate if you are interested.

My - Tom & Emma had a lot of children ! That should keep you going on FREEBMD for a while!

I have checked the 1891 again and it definately says 33 Baker St (not 30) and the head is John.  On the 1881 & 1871 is says 30 Baker Street and the head is Tom.  Wonder if he was a John.T ?

If you need any help just give me a shout!

[whiteroselass]

WOW.  What a response, I do have quite a bit of information regarding the family but you have filled in alot of missing pieces in the jigsaw.  With so many in the families it is easy to be sidetracked.  There are alot of interesting facts coming to light,  and I will work through all you have sent.

Thanks again.

Chris

[whiteroselass]

Hi Cheshiremog
Tom and Emma did have loads of children but they lost the following as children

John Thomas  1859 - 22/6/1863
Lilley               1860 - 19/6/1863
Agnes             1866 - 1872
Arthur             1872 - 1885
Tom                1875 - 1877

I agree it is a mystery as to where William Fred was in 1871 - he was my greatgrandfather and his daughter Marian my grandmother.  He would have been 12 at the time and maybe gone to stay with relatives - they maybe needed the room!!!!!.

[cheshiremog]

Hi Chris
On the 1861 William H (also lokked like William F) is with his grandfather John.
On the 1871 he is with his sister??  Jane and her husband Leonard Outwin.  I had to look at three census to get Jane & Leonard's surnames and still not entirely sure as very hard to read and often mis-transcribed.  Looks like Outwin.

1852 Q1 Double Marriage:-
Jane Cardwell m. Leonard Outwin in Doncaster
on same page
Mary Ann Cardwell m. Alexander Mackie

1861 Doncaster 21 Cemetery Road

Leonard Outwin Hd Mar 32 Locomotive Fitter b. Yorks Clayton
Jane   wife 29 b. London ??
Kate Dau 7 b. Donc
John Henry Son 4 b. Donc
Lucy Dau 2 b. Donc

1871 Doncaster South Union Street
Leonard Ontwin? Hd Mar 41 Carriage Fitter b. Yorks, C??
Jane wife 39 b. Middx London
Kate dau 17 unm b. Donc
John H Son 14 Farmers Servant b. Donc
Lucy Dau 12 scholar b. Donc
Leonard son 6 scholar b. Donc
WILLIAM H? F? CARDWELL nephew 11 Scholar b. Donc
Thomas Schofield Lodger 63 Shoe Maker b. Yorks Fishlake

[cheshiremog]

Don't quite see where Hane Cardwell fits in - especially as she is born in London ?  Do you know ?  Odd that William Cardwell is with his grandfather on the 1861 and with Jane in 1871?

1881 Res Shoreditch Hackney London
Jane Oulwin?  Widow 49 b. Shoreditch Middx
John Henry son 24 Labourer Road b. Donc
Lucy Johnston dau mar 22 Labourer's Wife b. Donc
Leonard  son 16 upholsterer b. Donc
George Baker 21 lodger b. Middx
Emma Johnson (yes says Johnson not Johnston) grand daur 1 b. Donc

On the 1861 Cemetery Road seemed to be populated by engine drivers & loco fitters and their families - so perhaps homes provided by their employers ?

[whiteroselass]

I dont have William Fred Cardwell as having a sister Jane, but he has an Aunt Jane(1831), who is the sister of his father Tom (1836). I have their parents as John Cardwell(1805) and Mary Ann Roadhouse(1806).

The only Mary Ann Cardwell(1866) I have is the daughter of Cornelius (1842) and Jane (1841), Cornelius being another brother of Tom and Jane above. This Mary Ann is not the one you found the marriage for as the marriage was in 1852.

This plot thickens. The Cardwells are relatives on my fathers side,  I am also researching my mothers side and my great grandmother on that side was a Wagstaff and I have also found connections to Shoreditch London with that side.

The reason Cemetery Road seems populated with engine drivers etc is that I live in Doncaster and the 'Plant' works, up until a few years ago were a major engine building works, the home of the Flying Scotsman and the Mallard, so no real surprise there.  Doncaster is on the main East Coast line half way between London and Edinburgh.

Thanks again, I need to really study all this and try to get things in some semblance of order.  Why did they have to have such large families and move about.  Going back to the Wagstaffs in Shoreditch, one of the Wagstaffs married a Sarah Toogood whose Uncle was a Colonial Export Merchant and one of his daughters was born in Sydney NSW!!!!.

Chris

[cheshiremog]

Hi Chris
Glad if it was of help
At least you have lots to go on plus other relatives who keep popping up on the census.
If you need anything else - just let me know

Mog

[whiteroselass]

You mentioned earlier about newspaper articles regarding the 2 young Cardwell soldiers Killed in Action.  Just thought you might be interested in the entry,

Doncaster Gazette, 27 Sept 1918

Mr & Mrs Cardwell of ^ Milton Street, Doncaster have been informed thet their younger son Private Frank Cardwell K.O.Y.L.I. died in a hospital overseas on September 15th form wounds recieved in action 2 days previously.  A sister at the hospital, in a sympathetic letter, say he did not suffer much pain and was so good a patient.  He was buried today, she adds, with all military honour, in our little cemetery just near here, right on the top of the hill.
The deceased was only eightenn years and eight months old and was educated at the Christ Church School.  Before enlisting he was employed at Messrs Woodhouse's brass foundry, Hexthorpe.  He joined up in January last and went to the front in June.
His cousin private Thomas M Cardwell, 67 Cemetery Road, Doncaster, was recently reported to be prisoner in Germany.



It is nice to know he was not alone at the end.