Northumberland Fusiliers, 26th Tyneside Irish.

[KMFRoberts]

Hi Guys,
Can anyone help with information about the Tyneside Irish?
My Great Grandad, Adam Thornton signed up 15 Dec 1914 and served until 1918. I have found his pension record on ancestry but the pen is very blurred and I can't read all the details on the statement of services. I found some information on the net about the general activities of the regiment and I know there is a book about them.
What I would really like is if anyone else had relatives in the regiment during WW1 and had any pictures of them especially if they are named as I have no photo's of Adam. That said I am happy to learn as much as I can about the Tyneside Irish. Great Grandad came from Annfield Plain in County Durham and was 37 when he volunteered. Apparently my Grandad John William Thornton 15.09.1899 was also in the army, but I haven't been able to find his records so far. He was born in Dipton in Durham. He was injured during the war and my Aunt always said he blamed his stomach wounds for having chronic diabetes.
Any information very gratefully received,
Thanks for your time,
Kathryn.

[patrexjax]

Hello Kathryn,  You are SO fortunate that your great grandfather survived WWI....one of my Uncles who was also a Tyneside Irish was killed.... I'm sorry that I don't have any information to share with you other than to tell you that you can certainly be proud of him. Incidentally, fusiliers apparently were able to fire their rifles as fast as a machine gun!  Pat

[Michael Dixon]

Kathryn,

You are after info on the WW1 "Tyneside Irish".

And you write " I know there is a book about them"

A wee bit of an understatement !.  The book about the Tyneside Irish by John Sheen is like a "bible" on the TI.

It is absolutely brimming with photographs, as well as battle info and human interest bits about individuals.

It has several indexes that include every soldier, his home address, when he enlisted, whether wounded, and where buried if he was a fatality, etc, etc.

There is also a "sister" book by the same author on the Tyneside Scottish.

These books are available for referral in libraries and archives in the north-east... e.g. Newcastle City Librasry, and Tyne & Wear Archives.


The 26th Battalion of the Northumberland Fusiliers was also known as the 3rd Battalion , Tyneside Irish
(24th Bn = 1st TI, 25th Bn = 2nd TI, 27th Bn = 4th TI)

(20th=1st Tyneside Scottish, 21st=2nd TS, 22nd=3rd TS, 23rd=4th TS)

If you are unable to access a copy, I will look !

Michael Dixon
Newcastle

[KMFRoberts]

Hi Guys,
Thank you so much for the replies.
I am very lucky that Great Grandad Adam survived, my dad always said Grandad told him that Adam was a changed man when he returned. Goodness only knows what they all went through.
I think I might buy the Sheen book Michael as it seems to be the definitive text to answer the many questions I have. My brother is very keen to learn all about Great Grandad too. My dad was named after him and always talked about what a great gentle giant he was.
I really appreciate all the advice, thanks again and all of you have a good Christmas.
Regards,
Kathryn.

[Michael Dixon]

Both books (second hand etc) are available on Amazon web site.

Michael

[Mr J T Arthur]

The original book about the Tyneside Irish Regiment entitled 'Irish Heroes in the War' by John E. Redmond M.P., T.P. O'Connor M.P. and Joseph Keating was published in 1917. I have a copy and I believe that was where Mr Sheen got much of his information from.

The Irish Home Rule Bill had just passed it's third reading when WW1 broke out causing Home Rule to be suspended. My great uncle become a recruiting agent for the regiment on the understanding that if the Irish assisted in the war which everyone was told would be over by Christmas then Ireland would at long last be granted her freedom.

In spite of their sacrifices the British government reneged on their promise leading to the Irish war of Independence and more bloodshed, there is no doubt this Regiment would not have been formed had the volunteers known that that was to be the outcome.

Ironically we Irish family history researches are now paying the price of it all.  Whilst thousands of Irishmen were sacrificing their lives for the British Empire, the British government ordered the Irish census returns to be pulped to aleviate the paper shortage as a result of the war.

I do have a group photo of my great uncle which includes one of the men he recruited in uniform who was killed in action shortly after the picture was taken, but as Michael advises, if you get Mr Sheen's book there is plenty pictures to see in there.

J.T.A.

PS: There is an A. Thornton listed in my book of 1917.

[bendywendy]

Hi Kathryn
Did you every find the info you required about Adam Thornton, I have come across this thread as my Great Uncle served in the Tyneside Irish and was killed in France with no known grave.
I have the book Tyneside Irish by John Sheen and an A Thornton is listed:

Page 237  Appendix V
26th Northumberland Fusiliers  3rd Tyneside Irish
Page 246 Thornton A  Pte
26 Battalion Number /702 Company B
26 Anfield Place
Enlisted 15/12/1914
Discharge 9/1/1918  Cause Sick  To Depot

Regards
bendywendy

[KMFRoberts]

Thank you for the information. I did take everyone's advice and buy the book and what a book!!
I still haven't found anything on John William Thornton's (granddad) role in the war. My Aunt keeps saying he enlisted and was injured in the stomach but I haven't found any military records for him at all. He was born 1899 and at the time of WW1 lived at the same 26, Annfield Plain address. I am surprised they don't seem to have joined the same unit.
Again any detectives out there who can help I'd be very grateful.
Regards,
K

[bendywendy]

Hi Kathryn
There is a photo of Adam and his wife Maria on Ancestry public trees by this treeholder: yvonnewilcoxen1

I have found Adam's WW1 Service Records online and notice something "odd" about one of the children Eliza T/Joddeff 30 March 1906 being classed as Illigitimate to A.T which would refer to Adam Thornton being the father, then a line is struck through this info.... a bit odd as he and wife Maria Towdoff married Mar Q 1897 @ Lanchester, Co. Durham. Note on the SR his wife's surname is spelt Tordoff.

1911 cen shows a Liza Towdoff, niece, 5, born West Stanley interesting

I cannot find a birth for this person anywhere, have you, just seems rather puzzling.

Just to recapture you stating 

I am surprised they don't seem to have joined the same unit

At the beginning of WW1 most lads/men from same villages/towns/cities etc., did go into the same Battalions which was usually the one most associated with the area they lived in, as the war progressed many gaps were left within Regiments and some Battalions even vanished due to the amount of deaths and casualties, so the others were then put into whatever Regiment needed the men most, in fact my Great Uncle served with the Tyneside Irish, he being a deep rooted Yorkshire man this didn't go down well with him and he lost his life too.

Maybe you have heard of the Pals in WW1 these were formed by the men going from same districts into the same Regiments etc., see if you can find the various Pals in the area he lived and see if his name is noted, some were and some weren't.

I have found some Medal Index Cards for a John William/Wm/W Thornton on Ancestry:

John William Thornton Lincolnshire Regiment   26459   
John William Thornton Durham Light Infantry, York and Lancaster Regiment, York and Lancaster Regiment   30316, 34621, 34621   
John Wm Thornton 3rd E Lancs FA   354306   
John W Thornton Royal Garrison Artillery   154397   
John W Thornton Royal Engineers   101326   
John W Thornton Duke of Wellington's (West Riding) Regiment, Yorkshire Dragoons (Queen's Own), Royal Engineers, Royal Engineers   4267, 4386, 267307, WR/175663   
John W Thornton Royal Fusiliers, Labour Corps   315877, 405909   
John W Thornton The King's (Liverpool) Regiment, Army Service Corps   28633, T/393668   
John W Thornton Lincolnshire Regiment, Labour Corps   29017, 10060   
John W Thornton Prince of Wales's Own (West Yorkshire) Regiment   5649, 235100   
John W Thornton Prince of Wales's Own (West Yorkshire) Regiment, Royal Army Medical Corps   54039, 146915   
John W Thornton Yorkshire Regiment, Yorkshire Regiment, 4/Yorkshire Regiment   156, 200007, 4381451   
John W Thornton Yorkshire Regiment   4060, 241622   
John W Thornton Welsh Regiment, Machine Gun Corps, Army Service Corps   291092, 143450, M/415272   
John W Thornton Princess Louise's (Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders), Royal Engineers   3118, 148526   
John W Thornton Royal Tank Corps   316557   
John W Thornton  Army Service Corps   DM2/151333   
John W Thornton Royal Army Medical Corps   547, 354306   
John W Thornton Army Ordnance Corps   032676

Remember also he may not given his middle name or initial, just to add extra confusion for you 

Try and find the Service Records for these above and rule out the ones you find that isn't him.
Try and find these in other public trees too, again remember not everyone is diligent at their research so don't take it that any are correct, check yourself ask questions if you have too.

When you have tackled these and not located him, try searching through the dozens and dozens of John Thornton 

Good luck, if you need any more help or pointing in further directions just come back and ask any of us, we will do our best to help.

Regards
bendywendy