Author Topic: Was there a baby??  (Read 2056 times)

Offline cavvytri

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Was there a baby??
« on: Tuesday 04 December 07 09:25 GMT (UK) »
I have been trying to find my husbands family tree, and while researching a great uncle, I found his ww1 records. Apparently while he was in the Australian Imperial Force and posted to the UK, he went awol, and got married to a lady of 19 years of age in Aberdeen. After the war, he returned to Australia, and, as far as we have been able to find out, he never told his Australian family that he had married in the UK. :o His Aberdonian wife got a solicitor to write to the NSW police missing persons department to try to find him, but so far, I dont know if she (or they) ever did.(maybe as he was living in Victoria and South Australia). I was wondering if someone could do a birth look up for around the end of ww1 to see if there was any issue of the marriage. All I have is the name of the groom...Stanley Layman SHERIFF, and the brides first names were Mary Ann. I dont know her maiden name.
A long shot I know, but all help appreciated
Thanks
Cavvytri
Amos,Burnside,Cowan,Hamilton,Lawrie,Reid,Skeldon,(East Lothian, Berwickshire)
Matthew,Tough,Sheriff,Guild,Gourlay,Cundall,Brown(Angus,Midlothian&Australia)
Dunn,Coombs,Dalrymple,Newman,Elliott, Embleton,Day
(Northumberland,Hampshire,Kent,Middlesex)
McPherson , Perth, Scotland
Cameron, Perthshire

Offline hume

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Re: Was there a baby??
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 04 December 07 09:57 GMT (UK) »
Hi Cavvytri,

Details from the marriage:

11th December 1918 at Bou-Accord United Free Church, Rosemount Viaduct, Aberdeen

Stanley Layman Sheriff, farmer (gunman, Australian Field Artillery No. 3107), bachelor
Aged 24, usual residence: Nurcoung, Victoria, Australia. Presently at No. 4 ? Depot, Hurdcot, Wilts
Parents: James Sheriff, farmer, and Helen Mewilt (?)

Mary Ann Roberts, chemist's assistance, spinster.
Aged 18, usual residence: 19 Glenbervie Road, Torry, Aberdeen
Parents: John Roberts, plasterer (master), and Mary Archibald

Witnesses: Charles Johnston and Isabella M. Roberts

Unfortunately, ScotlandsPeople only has birth records up to 1906.

hume24

Offline cavvytri

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Re: Was there a baby??
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 04 December 07 10:06 GMT (UK) »
 :)Thankyou for the information....its a good start anyway!
This bloke seems to have been a bit of a "bad lad"---was court martialled and spent a lot of time disobeying orders etc lol.
By the way I have GILLON in my tree also from East Lothian and Midlothian.
Hugh age 36 born Dunbar on 1881 married to Elizabeth born Dirleton
children Alison, Robina,Agnes,John,James and Jane
Cavvytri
Amos,Burnside,Cowan,Hamilton,Lawrie,Reid,Skeldon,(East Lothian, Berwickshire)
Matthew,Tough,Sheriff,Guild,Gourlay,Cundall,Brown(Angus,Midlothian&Australia)
Dunn,Coombs,Dalrymple,Newman,Elliott, Embleton,Day
(Northumberland,Hampshire,Kent,Middlesex)
McPherson , Perth, Scotland
Cameron, Perthshire

Offline hume

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Re: Was there a baby??
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 04 December 07 10:12 GMT (UK) »
Will send you a PM. We're related. :D

Glad the marriage information helped. I tried to find a death for Mary Ann, but given her age, it's possible she lived beyond 1956. I also tried searching for a re-marriage, but I suspect it would be under her maiden name and Roberts is a popular name. ;D

hume24


Offline smlindsa

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Re: Was there a baby??
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 29 May 25 18:08 BST (UK) »
I know that this thread is very old, but I have compiled extensive research for Stanley Layman Sheriff and am happy to share with anyone interested. I have several digital newspapers of his life, including of his marriage to Mary Ann Roberts in Aberdeen, Scotland, Nov 1918. Mary is submitting her missing person report in 1919, as he never returned to Scotland for her. By 1923, she immigrates to the US, eventually marrying again to a man named Walter Thomas Madden. He died in 1968, she in July 1979 ultimately of cancer.

I'd love any collaboration on Stanley's daughter, who only appears unnamed in a single source that I've found - a loan application as ex-military. Public Record Office Victoria; Victoria, Australia; Land Selection Files, Section 12 Closer Settlement Act 1938; Series Number: VPRS 5714.

Happy to collaborate or share what I know, I'd love any input from anyone who knows more.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Was there a baby??
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 29 May 25 20:39 BST (UK) »
There's no record of the birth in Scotland of anyone with surname Sh*r*f* and mother's surname Roberts between 1915 and 1924.

Could there have been an illegitimate child? SP does not include the mother's maiden surname if the birth was illegitimate and registered in the mother's name. (I don't understand the logic of this, because a blank gap where the mother's maiden surname normally appears in a year when other mothers' surnames are indexed actually proclaims to the world that the child was illegitimate, making it more, not less, obvious.) There is a birth of a William John Roberts with no mother's surname in Aberdeen St Nicholas in 1918. If you think he might be the mystery baby you could have a look at that to see who the mother was. There is also a William Roberts in Logie Buchan the same year, but that's a bit out of Aberdeen.

Did she take the child with her to the USA? Have you found her and her new husband in the 1930/1940/1950 US census?

Quote
Bou-Accord United Free Church
That is Bon-Accord, not Bou-accord.

Quote
Unfortunately, ScotlandsPeople only has birth records up to 1906.
Scotland's People has birth records up to last month. You can only view online birth records over 100 years ago, marriages over 75 years ago and deaths over 50 years ago, which is why you couldn't see births after 1906 18 years ago.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline PatLac

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Re: Was there a baby??
« Reply #6 on: Friday 30 May 25 03:19 BST (UK) »
Stanley was the son of Jessie SHER(R)IFF before she married to Albert Joseph BROOKSBY. Apparently he was raised as the son of his grandparents, James SHERIFF and Ellen MEWETT

Record information

Event: births
Registration number 33993 / 1893
Family name: SHERIFF
Given name(s) Stanley
Place of event: NATI, Australia
Personal detail

Mother's name Jessie
Mother's family name at birth SHERIFF
Father's Name: <Unknown Family Name>, Unknown


Record information

Event: deaths
Registration number 8018 / 1968
Family name: SHERRIFF
Given name(s) Stanley Lehmann
Place of event: Horsham, Australia
Personal detail

Mother's name  Ellen
Mother's family name at birth MEWETT
Father's Name:  SHERRIFF James


Could this girl be their daughter?

Surname   Forename         Mother's Maiden Name   Gender Year      Ref                   RD Name   
SHERIFF ELIZABETH B FAI                                     F      1919     685 / 4 / 1676              St Giles


And, apparently, his grandfather was Scotish.

James Sheriff
Birth • Scotland, Presbyterian & Protestant Church Records, 1736-1990

James Sheriff person details
Name   James Sheriff
Birth Date   

5 December 1846
Father's Name   Charles Sheriff
Mother's Name   Mary Williams
Event Type   Baptism
Event Date   1846
Event Place   Scotland, United Kingdom

Marriage:

SHERIFF
CHARLES
MARY WILLIAMS/
12/06/1840
274
20 / 277

Offline smlindsa

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Re: Was there a baby??
« Reply #7 on: Friday 30 May 25 03:37 BST (UK) »
I am amazed at the responses; I just joined the community but did not expect such help.

On 30 June 1921, Stanley is applying for land for farming. He identifies as a Widower, as being 27 years old, and as having one dependent, a "daughter (1 yr 8 mos)".

The only woman I know of in Stanley's life is Mary Ann Roberts, whom he married in Aberdeen in Nov 1918. At some point in 1919, she's filing a missing persons report, "They were supposed to be going to Australia, but he has put it off, and now she doubts his background and wants it checked."

She immigrates with her family in Oct 1923. If the baby in question were hers, she would have been born in the interim, then surrendered to Stanley for him to take back to Australia. It's possible, but seems improbable. In that rare case, I can almost imagine Stanley just reporting his wife as dead for the sake of simplicity. I'm grateful for the group verifying no Scottish female birth records support that hypothesis.

The other (now more likely) option is that the daughter is the offspring of Stanley and some other woman, potentially an Australian.

To the question of Mary Ann Roberts in the USA, she is with her Father and brother in Des Moines, Polk, Iowa, USA in the Iowa 1925 Census, still identifying as Mary Sheriff. By 1930 US Census, she appears as Mary A Roberts, with mom and dad. By 1940 she has married again, US Naturalization process in Sep 1943.

Stanley records I've found just indicate he struggled in farming and dealt with bankruptcy court in 1931. Eventually probate of his will granted things to a Malcolm Thomas Brooksby (half-brother). No daughter is mentioned.

I've looked for the daughter but haven't found her. Approx. DOB per the land doc would be Oct 1919.

Offline PatLac

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Re: Was there a baby??
« Reply #8 on: Friday 30 May 25 03:51 BST (UK) »
Oh I was going to post this one...  ;D

SHERRIFFS
MARY ANN
F
1919
249 / A / 18
Udny