1891/1901 census look-up - RIMMER

[Chorlton]

This website; http://www.old-merseytimes.co.uk/Southportshipping.html
 states the Brig Lascelles in 1822; vessel and crew all lost, between Formby Point and Southport.

Also the Brig ROSA in 1823, again all crew lost.

[suemuffy]

Thank you Chorlton for your time and effort to look up this information.
I had already seen these ships in the Shipwrecks Index of the British Isles and discounted them, the unidentified one looked a possibility.
Despite the foreign sounding name, The Rosa was, I think, registered in Plymouth and The Lascelles was on her way back from Maranham, Brazil and I discounted it for some other reason.
I appreciate your interest.

Sue

[wilcoxon]

I  was allowed to look through a list of shipwrecks off the Lancashire coast but there was no mention of an Italian ship. however there was a schooner (so we are not talking fishing boat here) which floundered in Formby channel on 23/11/1821 but name, cargo and destination unknown, suggesting no survivors. It's the right time scale but I may be jumping to conclusions.

This might be the schooner, the timing is about right.

Liverpool Mercury etc (Liverpool, England), Friday, November 30, 1821

On Saturday morning a schooner foundered in Formby Channel and all on board perished. She is supposed to be the `Lively ` from Dublin, a boat with Lively or Lovely of Cardigan on the stern having being washed up on Monday morning. Two of the bodies were also found in the course of the day.
Also early on Friday morning the sloop Cambridge from Ireland with pigs was driven on shore near theRocks and two of the crew drownded. .No vessels have been able to sail since Monday week.

[suemuffy]

Yes, it is quite possible but I am surprised that the Liverpool record office Shipwrecks Index list of wrecks did not have the name when the local newspaper did. It is likely I had seen the report of this Welsh vessel and discounted it as I was looking for a foreign registered ship, there were a number of wrecks in that same week. Of course we don't know if this Italian seaman/officer was actually on a Italian ship, mariners took ships from different countries on a regular basis.

[Cfhed]

Hi,

I have been doing some family history research and I was delighted to find that Sue's family also had a myth about Mr Formby. Therefore, I would like to pass on the information that has been handed down through the generations on my side. Our version of Mr Formby's story is as follows:

He was found as a young man wondering on Formby beach after a supposed shipwreck. He spoke no English, just Italian. He had no idea what had happened to him, where he came from, or who he was really- it was supposedly a case of amnesia. He soon settled in the area and was named after the beach he was found on, hence Mr Formby, he found work and got married.

Over the years he learnt to speak English but he refused to learn how to read and write it- he'd always get someone else to read the newspaper to him. The story goes that after many years when he was much older, some Officials wanted to speak to him but he refused to engage with them and he 'played dumb'. I note on one census he has been ticked as being "blind, deaf or dumb'. I wonder if this could perhaps offer an explanation as to why he never learnt to read or write English, or whether this was because he supposedly had amnesia, or if he was faking it/hiding something.

His name was pronounced 'Loo-eee' like the Central European name 'Louis', which could explain why the spelling in one census is different and the name was passed down for a few generations. But we've always referred to him as Mr Formby.

If he is the person listed as 'Lewis Workhouse' in the 1841 census, the approximate age of 15 would fit our version of his life as being a young man. As for the father named on his marriage certificate, we strongly believe that this is a lie but there ut cannot be proven or disproven.

One family rumour is that he was a stowaway on board a ship that got into trouble off the coast of Formby. Another is that he was wanted for something in Italy so left and went on the run. Obviously over the generations the story could have changed and/or been exaggerated so we'll never know what truely happened. Of course, Sue's version could be closer to the truth.

It's at moments like this that I wish I had a time machine so I could go back and find out.