Matthew DAVIES, Blaenavon/Ebbw Vale ?

[fluffnco]

Hi Adele

I have done another search of the 1891 using Eliza Davies as the search name and lo and behold the Matthew Davies family are still in Ebbw Vale at the same address. 
The bad news is there is still no sign of Beatrice Davies living with this family.  The 1891 census gives:

Rg12/4358  44  12     25 Victoria Road,  Ebbw Vale

Matthew Davies         H   42  Hitcher at Colliery     b.  Monmouthshire
Eliza Davies               W   42                                  b. Bedwelty
David Davies              S    14                                  b.       "
Marg Edith Davies      D    11                                  b.       "
Isaac Davies               S     5                                   b.       "
Thomas J. Jones      Neph  18  Haulier                    b.       "

I have done a search for Beatrice Davies in the  census for Bedwelty and the only one I have come across of the right age (approx 10)  is the daughter of a John and Elizabeth Davies living in the Tredegar area, which is only a few miles from Ebbw Vale.  Both parents and Beatrice were born in Tredegar and John's occupation is Foreman at Iron Works.

So unfortunately the Matthew and Beatrice details do not match.  I was pretty sure the birth index for Beatrice was the one you were searching for, I do hope I haven't sent you down the wrong path.

I will do a wider search in the census to see if I can come up with anything else and I will take a look for Matthew Davies in the birth indexes circa 1848.  Meanwhile, if you require the details of the Davies family in Tredegar, let me know and I will post them.

best wishes

Steve   

I've noticed that Harriet is missing in the 1891 census of the family. She must be working some where and living in or maybe at a neighbours with her baby sister Beatrice perhaps

I may have to pay for the GRO to search for her birth certificate as I have no other way of getting hold of a copy. What a bummer lol


Your help is greatly appreciated

Adele

[pritch19]

Hi Del

Yes I noticed Harriet was missing in 1891, I too thought she might be working or living elsewhere.  Sadly though, she may have died at an early age.  There is a record of a Harriet Davies age 7 dying in Bedwellty in1882, the death registered in the June quarter.

Hope the GRO comes up trumps for you, you'll have to let me know when you finally get Beat's cert.  I'm intrigued now, makes a change from trying to break down my own walls.   

Steve

[fluffnco]

Hi Steve

I'm going to take a chance and send off for the certificate you mentioned above. If it's not Beatrices  then I will ask the GRO to search for her. She's got to be in there some where

It hadn't crossed my mind that Harriet may have died. I'll look up that death in bedwelty too and see if it's her.

Sure hope I'm not barking up someone elses tree

Thanks for all your help and I'll certainly let you know what I find out


Del

[pritch19]

Hi Del

Did some searching among the birth indexes for Matthew Davies.  You said in an earlier post that you had found a record of him c. 1850 on freebmd so I did a check between 1847-51 on 1837online.  During this five year period only three Matthew Davies births are recorded around south east Wales:

Merthyr Tydfil    Sep  1848   Vol  26  Page  430
Merthyr Tydfil    Dec  1849   Vol  26  Page  434
Newport (Mon)  Mar  1851   Vol  26  Page  117

If as the 1881 census stated he was born in Blaenavon then I would have expected to find a registration recorded in Abergavenny, but these are the only three from around this area.  What was the registration area for the record on freebmd?  I know you cannot always take census info at face value, the family may have moved to Blaenavon when he was a young child and he may have well regarded it as his birth town, I have found this a few times tracing my own family.  He's proving very elusive your Matthew Davies.

By the way the death index for Harriet Davies is:

Bedwelty  June  1882  Vol  11A  page  69

Any other help I can provide, please don't hesitate to ask.  Good Luck   

Best

Steve

[fluffnco]

The one that fitted his birth year was Mar Qtr 1848 Montgomery vol. 27 page 93.

I recieved an email from a friend over in australia who had run a search through 1891 census for my Beatrice and came up with these for me.

1891 Wales census
RG12/4361
Civil parish: Trevethin
Ecc Parish : Trevethin
Registration district:Pontypool
Sub-registration district: Pontypool
Folio: 68 
Page: 19

21 North Road
John DAVIES       Head    Married 72  Engine Driver  Monmouthshire, Pontypool
Elizabeth DAVIES Wife     Married 72                     Pembrokeshire
Beatrice DAVIES  Grandaughter   11                      Monmouthshire, Pontypool



1891 Wales census
RG12/4361
Civil parish: Trevethin
Ecc Parish : Trevethin
Registration district:Pontypool
Sub-registration district: Pontypool
Folio: 125 
Page: 10

Freehold Farm
Herbert DAVIES     Head      Widower 56 Farmer                Monmouthshire, Penalt
Maurie DAVIES      Son        Single    24 Blacksmith           Glouc, St Georges
Arthur DAVIES      Son        Single    18 Farmers son         Glouc, St Georges
Harriet Duffield     Neice      Single    28 Domestic Servant  London
Edward Duffield    Nephew   Single    23 Ironworker           London
Beatrice DAVIES Grandaughter           9 Scholar               Chepstow, Monmouthshire
Lily Robins Grandaughter                   7 Scholar               Gloucestershire
Edward M Lewis   Serv        Single    14 Farm Servant       Monmouthshire, Newport



1901 London census
RG13/105
Civil parish: St Marylebone
Ecc Parish : All Souls
Registration district:St Marylebone
Sub-registration district: All Souls
Folio: 7 
Page: 6
 
30 Mortimer Street
Beatrice DAVIES Boarder  Single 19   Waitress    Glamorganshire, Cardiff
 

1901 Bershire census
RG13/1153
Civil parish: St Lawrence
Ecc Parish : St Lawrence
Registration district:Reading
Sub-registration district: St Giles
Folio: 33
Page: 5
21 Broad Street
Thomas Spindler      Head Married 38  Bootmaker   Bucks
Lydia A Spindler      Wife  Married 37                   Glouc, Bristol
Gertrude M Spindler Daughter      10                    Berks, Reading
Beatrice DAVIES      Visitor Single  19                   Chepstow, Monmouthshire
Albert J Maker        Visitor Single  26   Tailor         Devon
 

some of these look quite good prospects for her. Guess a lookup to see if any of these families had a matthew who fits the bill in previous census would be the order of the day. Proper slippery customers these Davies

both of the 1891 Beatrices are around the right age which is a start LOL

Thank you very much for the info on births for Matthew and also harriets death entry details. If it proves to be my Harriet I will send for the cert.

Del

[pritch19]

Hi Del

The Beatrice Davies born in Chepstow looks like an interesting connection.  I notice she relatives from London living with the family in Trevethin in 1891 and she herself is living in London in 1901.  I've tried to trace the Herbert Davies family for a connection to Matthew Davies in both the 1881 and 1871 census unsuccessfully so far. 

The other family John and Elizabeth Davies are in the Pontypool area in 1881 and 1871.  No Matthew Davies living with the family in either year.  The odd thing about the 1881 record is that Beatrice is not listed, the family members are:

John Davies           62      Head
Elizabeth Davies    62      Wife
Agnes Davies         24      Daughter
Alice Davies            10months  Granddaughter

So is it possible she could be Alice Beatrice or Beatrice Alice?

Regarding Matthew Davies it may be worthwhile to post a census lookup request on the Monmouthshire board.  There may be a record in the Pontypool or Trevethin area in 1851/61 if he was born in Blaenavon.  There are a few helpful people doing speedy lookups for 1851/61.  I've had a few done myself and have always had a good and quick response.

Steve   

 

[fluffnco]

Hi steve

You really are a star! I did a search for Matthew and Eliza(beth) on the Freebmd search site and found a Matthew Davies married to an Elizabeth JONES in Mar qtr 1872 11a 121 in Bedwelty, Monmouthshire

In the 1891 census run you did previously there is a nephew
Thomas J. Jones      Neph  18  Haulier                    b.       bedwelty

I'm wondering if maybe my Beatrice might be found with Elizabeth's parents although I haven't been successful yet at finding their names on the church of latter day saints site

The other thought I had was that Matthew and Beatrices mother weren't married and as Matthew is hard to find I did a general search for Matthew Davies in Monmouthshire on the familysearch site and came up with this little gem

 Household:

 Name  Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
 John Nicholas JAMES   Head   M   Male   48   Gellygaer, Glamorgan, Wales   Platelayer     
 Rachel JAMES   Wife   M   Female   60   Pontypool, Monmouth, England       
 Matthew DAVIES   Stepson   U   Male   21   Tredegar, Monmouth, England   Engine Tender     
 Rachel JAMES   Daughter   U   Female   16   Tredegar, Monmouth, England   Domestic Servant At Home     
 Benjamin EDMONDS   Lodger   U   Male   61   Caerphilly, Glamorgan, Wales   Engine Tender     


~~~~~~~~
Source Information:
  Dwelling   33 River Row
  Census Place Bedwellty, Monmouth, Wales
  Family History Library Film   1342262
  Public Records Office Reference   RG11
  Piece / Folio   5243 / 104
  Page Number   7
 

As I have no idea whether Beatrice had any older siblings it may well be that she was the first child and that Matthew married the mother after the birth. Going to make it hard to find the mum so I've sent off for that Beatrice born in Bedwelty and have everything crossed its her. Will let you know in due course if it is or not

Will be interesting to see what the mother's name is on the certificate when it arrives although that may be sometime given that a certificate I ordered prior to xmas has not turned up yet.


Del

[pritch19]

Hi Del

Been burning the midnight oil I see      Well done finding the marriage index for Matthew and Elizabeth, the certificate may prove interesting reading.

I've been doing a few more census searches for you.  Checked the 1871/91 on Ancestry and I think I can safely say there are no Matthew Davies in Monmouthshire with a daughter Beatrice.  I didn't check the 1881 as you have already done so on LDS.

Also did another search covering Monmouthshire 1881/91 for Beatrice Davies living with a Jones family and again had no hits.  They really are an elusive lot these Davies.

As for the Matthew Davies you found in the 1881, he is also there in the 1871:  RG10/5321  Fol 66  Page 6    Dwelling:  Manmoel, Bedwellty


John Nicholas Jane      Head               41   widower   
Rachael Davies            Housekeeper  49   widow
Ann Davies                   Daughter        20   single
Soloman Davies           Son                 17    single
Mary Susanah Davies  Daughter         14
MATTHEW DAVIES        Son                  11
Rachael Davies            Daughter            6
Benjamin Edwards       Boarder           48    single

The occupations and place of birth same as 1881, the younger children were all born in Tredegar.    All Rachael's children are enumerated as Davies.  The handwriting isn't clear on the actual record but it does look like Jane, not James for John Nicholas.

Hope that certificate arrives sooner than later and contains some good news for you.  I received one this morning that I ordered on Dec 8 (definitely didn't contain good news    )

Best Wishes

Steve   

[fluffnco]

Hope that certificate arrives sooner than later and contains some good news for you.  I received one this morning that I ordered on Dec 8 (definitely didn't contain good news    )

Hi Steve

sorry to hear you didn't get what you were hoping to. It's a real bummer when that happens

I did a search on the IgI for Rachel Davies and John James marriage going off the census for 1871 where they were both enumerated as being a widow and widower.I found a likely candidate in Dec Qtr of 1871 in Newport, Monmouthshire  Vol: 11a  Page: 386.

I would presume as they'd both been previously married they may have decided on a registry wedding. There is also a Francis Davies and a Edith Hawkins listed on the same page. Maybe Francis and Rachel were related in some way and had a double wedding? who knows.

So guess next step is a search for a Rachel Davies and hubby Davies plus children prior to 1871 in this area or near by. I'm presuming Matthews father was a coalminer and lost his life in the pit or due to some serious illness.

If this is my Matthew it makes his birth year 1860 so he should show up as a 1 year old or several months old in the 1861 census and I am presuming his father was alive around that time (boy I must surely have a shirlock in my family tree some where )

If I can help you in return for all the help you've given me Steve please don't hesitate to ask

Del