Henry WARREN

[lucaduca]

Hi Silvery, what I do have is a  free BMD marriage in Lambeth september 1840
vol 4 page 238, marriage of  Amelia Penicud and Henry Warren, this was sent to me
by a distant cousin,  my grandfather james william henry warren was born 1845
in birmingham at some stage he came to Australia and married Grace Stephens in 1875 in Victoria, there is a little of this on Familysearch.org   in Ancestral file.
many thanks Lucaduca

You won't know you have the right couple until you get the cert with the fathers' names and occupation, and the groom's occupation.

Have you got a birth cert of one of the children for mother's maiden name?
This would also give you father's occupation.  This can be a help in tracking them down in the census.

[silvery]

Yes.  That is the marriage cert you will need to get for the fathers' names, so that you can be sure who you are tracing.

Have you got your grandfather's birth certificate which will show his mother's maiden name?

Kenn, Devon, is near Exeter.  Devonport is Plymouth.

[lucaduca]

Hi Silvery, no  I have nothing at all on paper and of course they are all gone,  should I apply to Devon office for marriage or birth cert', which of these would give me the most info. regards Lucaduca

[silvery]

BIRTH cert would give you the father's name and occupation, and the mother's maiden name.   
 
But the MARRIAGE cert would give this information plus their ages and their fathers' names which is extremely useful in tracing them, and the father's name could be a reference point for the birth certificate. (So you could eliminate any with the wrong father)

You have the reference for the marriage cert.
Order from the General Register Office (GRO) cost £7
http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/
reference
Marriages Sep 1840   (>99%)
Hodges    Sarah        Lambeth    4   238   
Jennings    John         Lambeth    view
LYON    James         Lambeth    4   238   
Nicholls    Joseph         Lambeth    4   238   
PENICUD    Amelia         Lambeth    4   238   <<<<<<<<<
WALTERS    Ann         Lambeth    4   238   
WARREN    Henry         Lambeth    4   238   <<<<<<<<<
WILLMOT    Thirza Letford         Lambeth    4   23

Do you have a reference number for the birth cert? (for James William b1845 - where was he born - can't see him on freebmd.)

The child born 1848 has a VERY similar middle name to Amelia's maiden name, do I am inclined to think it may be the correct marriage

Births Sep 1848   (>99%)
Warren    Edward Penioud Languin        Stourbridge    18   518

If you are certain of the children it may be worth getting at least one of their birth certs, just to confim the mother's maiden name (mmn).

[lucaduca]

Silvery, thank you for all that ,no, I do not have a reference number for the birth cert, where did you see Edward's names? I am  not certain about anything but you have given me much more than I 've ever had,very good

[lucaduca]

Silvery , james 's birth is on Ancestral File,Familysearch.org  James William Henry Warren b 1845 Birmingham  .

BIRTH cert would give you the father's name and occupation, and the mother's maiden name.   
 
But the MARRIAGE cert would give this information plus their ages and their fathers' names which is extremely useful in tracing them, and the father's name could be a reference point for the birth certificate. (So you could eliminate any with the wrong father)

You have the reference for the marriage cert.
Order from the General Register Office (GRO) cost £7
http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/
reference
Marriages Sep 1840   (>99%)
Hodges    Sarah        Lambeth    4   238   
Jennings    John         Lambeth    view
LYON    James         Lambeth    4   238   
Nicholls    Joseph         Lambeth    4   238   
PENICUD    Amelia         Lambeth    4   238   <<<<<<<<<
WALTERS    Ann         Lambeth    4   238   
WARREN    Henry         Lambeth    4   238   <<<<<<<<<
WILLMOT    Thirza Letford         Lambeth    4   23

Do you have a reference number for the birth cert? (for James William b1845 - where was he born - can't see him on freebmd.)

The child born 1848 has a VERY similar middle name to Amelia's maiden name, do I am inclined to think it may be the correct marriage

Births Sep 1848   (>99%)
Warren    Edward Penioud Languin        Stourbridge    18   518

If you are certain of the children it may be worth getting at least one of their birth certs, just to confim the mother's maiden name (mmn).

[silvery]

I can't find James William b1845 on the IGI at the moment, tho I'm not sure what you mean by 'ancestral search'.  However that doesn't surprise me! (being me)   

Perhaps you had better come forward in time, in order to work back.

Have you got your grandfather's marriage certificate?

Who did your grandfather marry?  It would be better to start with him, and then check backwards.  Go through the census etc. But someone else will need to come in here, because I don't have an ancestry sub at the moment.

 From your grandfather's marriage certificate you would be sure of the name of his father. 
But we can check for the marriage on freebmd. http://www.freebmd.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl if we have the name of his wife.

Do you know who your grandfather's siblings were? 

[ Jane - message three - had Edward b1848 details -  from the census.]

Can't find James William b1845 on Ancestral File either. 

What was his wife's name?  first name might do.

[lucaduca]

[Silvery,  you go to familysearch.org, this program is run by church of Latter Day Saints= LDS     when page comes up , look to left hand side index, select  second on list  Ancestral file.  this is the search engine for info ,put in my grandfather's name james william henry warren  born 1845 england then search, you will get  his wife and children, one being my father Harry warren 1888 . my grandfather's siblings are the children of henry and Amelia my grandfather is James William  as seen on 1861 Westminster census,I do have a number here in Melbourne for marriage cert which I could , what do you think?James William born 1845 married in 1875 inVictoria wife's name Grace Stephens born1855 Victoria parents were William Stephens b 1831 in Nancekuke, Mother Alice Crothers b1832 Nancekuke Eng .....get quote author=silvery link=topic=266140.msg1511578#msg1511578 date=1194297706]
I can't find James William b1845 on the IGI at the moment, tho I'm not sure what you mean by 'ancestral search'.  However that doesn't surprise me! (being me)   

Perhaps you had better come forward in time, in order to work back.

Have you got your grandfather's marriage certificate?

Who did your grandfather marry?  It would be better to start with him, and then check backwards.  Go through the census etc. But someone else will need to come in here, because I don't have an ancestry sub at the moment.

 From your grandfather's marriage certificate you would be sure of the name of his father. 
But we can check for the marriage on freebmd. http://www.freebmd.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl if we have the name of his wife.

Do you know who your grandfather's siblings were? 

[silvery]

Blimey      what a ......... I am.  You DID say in one of the replies married to Grace Stephens, Australia.   Oh Oh Oh  Pay attention silvery.

I was searching in UK.  Right got it!  So you are happy with the census returns info etc etc.  Forget marriage cert for your grandfather.  My fault.   

Just that marriage cert then for Amelia and Henry 1840, for the father's names.  Then you can go back - possibly on the igi.   It may be that one from Kenn, you never know.  It's definitely igi or parish records for that time.

It's a nice very early marriage cert to have.  My earliest is 1853.  And then they fade out in Ireland.  No chance of finding them.