Tilby/James mystery still unsolved - FYI those who helped before

[Neil Todd]

Hi please remove your email address it is much safer to make one more post and you can use the Personal message system, also please remove any names of living people as per Rootschat Policy.

Neil

[jorose]

Quite confusing, James births in Dubbo:

Mary J. daughter of Annie (no father registered) - 1895
then daughter(s) in 1910 and 1912 are also registered under both Davis (with parents William and Miriam) and James (with just Miriam).

Is it possible those are late registrations? I can't think of any reason why a child registered in 1912 to parents married 1910 would be listed twice, once as if illegitimate, unless these were kids born before the marriage and William was adopting them/having them registered or re-registered as his kids.

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XTZQ-LDC
 - Stanley's 1905 marriage.

[katefarr]

Wow this is fantastic after all these years (and about 3 years of being unable to login for some unknown reason!) 

I have sent you a PM Kerrykat

Jorose, thank you so much, I never realised the births of their daughters were registered under her maiden name as well as her married.  How strange, the couple was married in Oct 1910, so the first daughter was Florence M born in 1910 (this would also have been out of wedlock) but why is she reregistered in 1912?  I had always assumed that the second Florence M was a twin to Daisy but as Florence is registered with the exact initial and that Florence M died 1912 (I assume the 'twin' if that was the case at all) why were the 'twins' birth under the name of James as well as Davis?  I am totally confused by this couple   Miriam was a strange lass, she left Alfred with all the kids after 1920 taking off with Claude Horice Burns with whom she had 3 children but never married.  However she is buried under the name of Burns though her death certificate says Davis.

As Miriam was born 1889 the birth in 1895 of Mary J could not possibly be ours.  I have come to think that Tilby was a smoke screen myself as Miriam came from Dubbo, the same place as William.  Perhaps she went to Sydney and he followed, it still took a further two years for him to marry her though?

Ahhh the mysteries, love it

Thanks again for the renewed interest

Kind Regards Kate

[Neil Todd]

THERE has to be a reason !! People don't do things with some cause to effect. In my family my grandparents never actually married. Their early children were registered under her former married name and the later (after the death of former husband) were named in my grandfathers name. But they were all HIS as the former husband was on the other side of the country. Took a bit of working out

SO; why did this happen?? 1. She may have still been married, 2 Her former husband may have disappeard, 3 She wouldn't get divorced or couldn't because of stigma.

The has to be a reason.

Neil

[Neil Todd]

FROM KerryKat;

Like you, I have been intrigued by the Tilby name on Alfred Davis' marriage certificate to Mary Wolfenden. The only Tilby I can locate in Dubbo around the time of Alf's birth is a Stanley Tilby. Given that Albert was born in 1908 and Miriam married William in 1910 suggests that Albert was, as stated on his original birth certificate, illegitimate. Then William Davis came along, married Miriam & reared Alfred as his own. Alfred's birth certificate states "evidence has been furnished that the full name of the within mentioned Alfred Stanley James is Alfred Stanley James Davis". Given that Alfred's second christian name is Stanley gives indication that Stanley (coupled with the Tilby name on Alf's marriage certificate) Tilby was Alf's birth father.

I think this makes good sense

I also read into this a estrangement from her family, do you have her birth certificate? Women who fell pregnat then quite often were sent away until after baby is born and then sometimes parents rear as own, sometimes they had it adopted out, sometimes the woman put up with all sorts of hardships to rear it alone and sometimes they met some nice man who took both in and reared the child together

Neil

[katefarr]

It does make sense in the names - that Tilby was the father, but one piece of information that was interesting was the youngest child of Williams first marriage - Leslie - was my pops spitting image, suggesting the same father?  There is also a hint that they may have been of Aboriginal descent but I am not sure where that comes into play??  I found this out today talking with family.   I was wondering if this may be part of the reason for information being hard to come by??

Apparently Miriam couldn't remarry as William would not give her a divorce.  She stayed with Claude Burns until he died.

Regards

Kate

[Neil Todd]

Just trying to make Google my friend again and typed in Tilby Family NSW.

Funny first thing that comes up is Department of Community Service ADOPTION AND FOSTERING?

Now what could I read into that, I wonder

Neil

[katefarr]

.... so if we assume that Stanley Tilby was the father of Alfred Stanley Davis I looked up for further information on the man

He was born 1881 and died 1969 in South Australia, there are no births registered to him and his wife in NSW.  Although this doesn't mean he couldn't be the father of course.  How did a girl from Dubbo come to meet a man from SA that married in Sydney 1905?  I can find no further trace of his name in the nsw indexes bmd or state archives suggesting his stay in nsw was not long.  Was he passing through Dubbo and she followed him to Sydney? Mmmm

Then again I am assuming that the information of her birthplace of Dubbo is correct, why should I when she clearly lied about it on a previous document and stated she was born in Victoria!  Perhaps she was in Sydney all along, but then how and why did William Davis a new widower go to sydney with young children and meet her?  I am thinking I need to regroup my thoughts as I feel quiet lost and can't see the proverbial forest for the trees at the moment