Deal Parish Lookup if possible please - updated with more information

[oleonepace]

Royalgaz

I had a quick squint at the Gt. Mongeham records while I was at the Canterbury archives today.... I couldn't find a Goodban/Wolf marriage between the dates you give.

If I get a mo over the next day or so I'll have a stroll and see if I can get a pic or two of the College Road houses for you. Much of College Road is 'intact'.

regards
Tony

[Royalgaz]

Thank you Tony that would be really lovely.

I wonder where they got married then, unless it was later then 1826, but thought it was normal for them to get married in area where their first born is. Although I guess if it was in her parish then it could have been Littlebourne or Deal or another surrounding area, this side of the family is never simple!

Thanks for your help Gary

[Bill749]

Hi Gary

According to the 1898 street directory, she was living at no. 50 College Road, on the corner of Cannon Street, which was, until recently, a fish and chip shop!

The numbering has changed several times since the 1800s - the houses used to be numbered sequentially up one side of the road and down the other.  In 1841, the last census that shows Stephen living, they are in Lower Street about 12 houses from Cannon Street, apparently to the north.  As the 1841 census does not give house numbers, it is not possible to be sure if this was No. 101.

In 1899, no. 48 would probably have been 2 doors down from No. 50 (south - nearer to the town centre).  Again, it is not possible to be sure if any of these were the same as 101 Lower Street.

Now, the numbering is odd on that side and even on the opposite side, and the corner property is No. 49.

This is College Road today.  I have some more pictures - if you let me have your e-mail address I will send them on to you.

Their first-born was baptised at Gt Mongeham, but their marriage did not take place there, or at Lt Mongeham.  Nor was it at Deal St Leonard's, where 3 more children were baptised some years later (there may be others in between, somewhere else) when they were living in Lower Street.

There were no other CoE churches in Deal at that time except St George's (unfortunately the records for this church are missing for the period of interest).  I also checked St Mary's in Walmer, but not Sholden.

There were a number of GOODBAN baptisms in Gt Mongeham in the late 1700s / early 1800s but no Stephen.

I have also checked for Stephen's burial between 1848 (baptism of youngest child) to 1851 (M.A. widow on census) but have not found him in Mongeham or Deal.

I will have another look for Frances Maria to see if she ever married.

The baptism of Amelia Jane was at Gt Mongeham St Martin on 27th January 1828, d/o Stephen & Mary Ann, of Gt Mongeham, labourer.

Bill

[Royalgaz]

Thank you for the photo Bill, have emailed you directly with my email address.

Thank you also for all your additional information, very helpful. Now I am becoming a bit puzzled. I have also been given the death certificate for Stephen Goodban and he died on the 3 December 1845 in Deal (no address stated), the informant was a Sarah Chapman present at the death of 104 or 109 Lower Street, Deal.

You said the last child who would be Frances Maria was baptised in 1848, was this just an oversite as I have down it was 22 May 1846 at St Leonards, Deal? I assume she was conceived before Stephen died but born after his death as she is born in 1846.

So according to the baptism record for Amelia, Stephen was from Great Mongeham?

Do this family ever stop becoming confusing for me??? Where on earth did they get married then I wonder.

Thank you so much for all your look ups and help. I would be extremely confused without your help.

Regards Gary

[Bill749]

Sorry, you're right - she was baptised in 1846, not 1848!

Stephen & Mary Ann were living in Great Mongeham when Amelia was baptised - they didn't have any other children baptised there and they weren't married there.  Stephen wasn't baptised there, nor, it would seem, was Mary Ann.

Unfortunately the 1841 census doesn't tell us where they were born and the 1851 has her down as Deal.

To add to the confusion, there is an Edward GOODBAN in the 1851 census with wife Mary A, quite close in age, living in North Sandy Lane (Golf Road).  He was born in Mongeham!

I have only found 4 children - Amelia Jane (1828), Benjamin Wolfe (1835), Stephen Arthur (1837) and Francis Maria (1846) - I haven't found Charles (c.1840) or Sarah (c.1843) and I would guess there must have been more as there are big gaps between these.  Do you have any more information?  It might give me more clues as to where to look next.

Bill

[casalguidi]

According to the 1861 census, Mary A was born in Sittingbourne ....................

1861

Lower Street (East Side), Deal

Mary A GOODBAN head wid 56 laundress b.Sittingbourne
Stephen son 23 lab b.Deal
Sarah A dau 17 dressmaker b.Deal
Frances dau 14 laundress b.Deal

RG9/543 folio 135 page 30
.........................

1871

101 Lower Street, Deal

Mary A GOODBAN head wid 66 laundress b.Deal
Sarah A dau 26 dressmaker b.Deal
Frances M dau 24 b.Deal

RG10/1004 folio 22 page 35
.......................

and now London

1881

101 High Street, Deal

Mary A GOODBAN head wid 76 b.London
dau (no name given) unm 34 b.Deal

RG11/998 folio 38 page 38
........................

1891

101 High Street, Deal

Mary A GOODBAN head wid 86 laundress b.Westminster London
Frances M dau 41 b.Deal
Lilian E RIVERS grandau 17 dressmaker b.Walmer

RG12/738 folio 137 page 27
....................

Does that widen the area for her possible marriage I wonder

Casalguidi

[Royalgaz]

Hi Bill

All I have for their children are:
Amelia Jane (Baptised in Great Mongeham)
Caroline Elizabeth (who Casalguidi found through IGI for me, but can not trace her in 1841 census, so possibly she died, who is meant to have been baptised in Great Mongeham according to the IGI)
Benjamin Wolfe (who died in 1841, Deal, baptised in Deal)
Stephen Arthur (Baptised in Deal)
Charles (who according to someone with some Deal parish extracts was baptised at St Leonards 21 Feb 1841)
Sarah Ann (just noticed don't have her baptism records)
Frances Maria (Baptised St Leonards, Deal)

I found the same information as Casalguidi has regarding the census that Mary Ann puts Deal, Sittingbourne and even Westminster as her places of birth. Just to confuse matters even more!

I traced someone with Sittingbourne parish records (probably extracts), who checked for a baptism of Mary Ann Wolfe and could not find one, they did not have the marriage records for the area. I did wonder if maybe it was Littlebourne? As for Westminster I have not got a clue where to go to try and check those records.

The only other information I can tell you is who the individuals seem to marry. Also Charles (my ggg grandfather changed his name sometime around 1861 to Charles Goodwin, stayed with that name most of his life, then in last few years of his life, reverted back to Goodban. I had another posting on here, that I have updated with this information (Looking for Goodwin's in Kent).

From all my notes I don't think I have any additional information. Except that one cousin believes (usual family stories) that Mary descends from Wolfe of Canada (can't remember the exact story, but he was some big man who saved Canada or something, have to check the internet). But as with all stories I have taken this with a ton of salt.

Gary

[casalguidi]

I've been having a scout around and saw references to a Arthur Wolf REEVE(S) bc1837 Dover and, thinking that the names "Arthur" and "Wolf(e)" weren't too common in this area at that time, decided to look further.

1841

Chapel Street, Dover St Mary

Steven REEVE 30 staymaker b.Kent
Sarah 25 b.Kent
Arthur 3 b.Kent
Jane 2 b.Kent
Sarah 1 b.Kent
/
Emily GOODBURN 15 female servant b.Kent

HO107/494 folio 11 page 15
.......................

There is a marriage Stephen REEVE to Sarah Ann WOLFE in Deal 1835 http://www.familysearch.org

Unfortunately, Sarah is deceased by 1851 so unable to ascertain her birthplace but there is a gourp of WOLFE (and variants) baptisms on the IGI at Sandwich St Mary (all with parents Arthur and Ann):

Jane 1807
Sarah Ann 1810
Sarah Ann 1813
George Buckness 1816
John Arthur 1819 (parents Arthur and Sarah)
George Philip 1823

George Buckness caught my eye as I recall the "BUCKMAN" name cropping up in your research and wonder if one or the other ie. BUCKNESS or BUCKMAN is a transcription error for the other?

Here are the parents, Arthur and Ann ............

1841

Sandwich St Mary

Arthur WOLFE 55 b.Kent
Ann 55 b.Kent

HO107/494 folio 14 page 21
........................

1851

Delf Street, Sandwich St Mary

Arthur WOLFE head mar 68 carpenter b.Selling
Ann wife 69 b.Boughton Kent

HO107/1631 folio 106 page 45
.......................

In 1861 Arthur is in Eastry Union Workhouse, a carpenter, age 78 b.Selling, Kent
RG9/539 folio 115 page 11
..................................

It could be significant don't you think?

Casalguidi

[Royalgaz]

You are one step ahead of me Casalguidi, I was just thinking about that mystery of Buckman (or whatever it is) as the middle name on a certificate and was just going to post about that. My wondering was if she was married before and Wolfe was her married name.

Also just looking back at my notes noticed that I was missing the 1881 census, but you found it mistranscribed and she mentions London in that one too. Very strange  .

I need to re-read what you have just posted as I am so mixed up now.

Thank you Gary