CORNHILL in New South Wales

[wdurham]

Having followed all the links suggested in the resource section, I have at last tracked a Joseph James CORNHILL to the Mudgee area of NSW.

Joseph James Cornhill was born in qe Mar 1848 in Whitstable, son of Joseph Cornhill and his wife Sarah Edenden nee Dyason. His brother Wallace was also born in Whitstable about 1855.

Joseph married Hannah Darby (b about 1851 in Deal), in 1868 and according to the 1881 census they had four children:

Helen M aged 5
Joseph J aged 4
John Thomas aged 1 b qe Sep 1879
Agnes Elizabeth aged 2 (actually 2 months) b qe Mar 1881

I haven't found births for Helen or Joseph J.

They were living in Chapel Street, Deal, Kent in 1881 and Joseph Snr was an unemployed baker. The children were all born in London except Agnes, who was born in Deal.

John Thomas died in 1833 in Eastry district, which covers Deal.

The entire family then disappear altogether. They are not in the 1891 or 1901 census returns. There are no deaths for any of them and no marriages for the children, even when checked under various spellings of the name. So I suspected emigration as a family and eventually, in the NSW database on-line I found a marriage:

A Joseph James Cornhill married Ada M Rope in 1891 in Mudgee

and two deaths:

Joseph Cornhill died in 1909 Dubbo aged 63
Ada Cornhill, daughter of James A and Elizabeth, died in 1917 in Mudgee

Further checking showed that Mary A Rope was born to James and Elizabeth Rope in 1862 in Mudgee. Probably the same girl - Mary Ada or Ada Mary - she may have been baptised as Mary, but always used her second name. (I do myself!)

At first I disregarded this as a coincidence. But then I found this:

Wallace Cornhill died in 1902 in Gunnedah

Cornhill is not a common name if correctly spelled, when I found the death for Wallace as well as for Joseph James, I thought I had found "my" Joseph James. The age at death is at least one year out - he was born in early 1848 so would have been 61/62 during 1909 not 63.

However, I am beginning to think this might still be a coincidence, because I cannot trace the arrival of Joseph James and his family, nor of Wallace.  The family must have moved to Australia after John Thomas's death in 1883, but before 1891.

I cannot find deaths for Hannah and the children, nor marriages for the children. I have searched under several variants of the surname without success, and in other states as well as NSW.

Does anyone have other ideas of where I might look?  And is there likely to be more information on the marriage and death certificates which might help identify this Joseph James or Wallace as "mine"?

[CuriousDiana]

Hi

A NSW marriage cert will give you age, birthplace, occupation, names of both parents of both parties to the marriage.  A death cert will give you age, names of both parents, how long in the colony, where born, place of marriage and to whom, names of children (in the case of the death cert, this info comes from an informant, so the info depends on the accuracy of the informant's knowledge).

You could write to the Mudgee Historical Society, P.O. Box 217, Mudgee, NSW, 2850. They may have some information re the Cornhill family.

Diana

[wdurham]

Many thanks, Diana - those certificates are very informative!

I shall take the advice I have already found on Rootschat, and get transcriptions of the entries I have found. The marriage certificate in particular should provide a definite link - or not, as the case may be!

[Robert Coble]

Hi wdurham,
It will tell you what you like to know there and it depends on the informant there that gave the information. a Death will give if they was born over seas there as well.
 

Regards,
OzyBob

[trish251]

Note that both the death certificates (Joseph and Wallace) do not contain parent names, so the informant(s)  knew little about the history of the person who died. The marriage should contain parent names IF the person being married supplied same.

The naa gave a number of records containing the name Cornhill - Of interest is the service of Ernest Edward Rope - next of kin initially given as Ada Rope - then changed to Ada Cornhill (perhaps because whoever completed the form assumed the name Rope?). He appears to have spent some time in England on leave at the end of the War.
http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/recordsearch.aspx
search as a guest.

There are 3 children born 1884, 86 and 87 - mother given as Ada Rope - no father listed in the index. Death for Ernest Rope lists mother Ada & father James J

Trish

[wdurham]

Many thanks, Trish!

I had found the service record of Ernest Rope when I first looked at this last year on a general hunt for any Cornhills in Australia. It didn't occur to me to look for his death to find an indication of his parentage - you rarely find such info on a UK death cert for an adult. But as you say, there it is - father James J.

Not conclusive, of course, as the names have been reversed and the surname isn't in the index entry. But Joseph James was the son of another Joseph, so may have used his second name - just like Ada Mary, who is Mary A at birth but Ada M everywhere else.

So that narrows it down - Joseph James is likely to have been still in UK in 1883 when John Thomas Cornhill died, and Wallace too, when his wife and son died in 1883/4 - and both were in the 1881 UK census with their families. But they were in Australia by 1887 when Ernest was born.

Of Ada's other two children Lilla May married Alfred Turner, and her death index listing gives her parents as Arthur and Agnes May. As the death particulars were probably supplied by her husband, the Agnes May could be simple error or a bad memory, but Arthur is unlikely to be confused with Joseph or James. Susan died in infancy, with just her mother listed, so no further clue there.

So what I need to prove the link is the death cert or a transcript for Ernest, and perhaps his marriage cert as well for additional confirmation, the marriage cert for Joseph James and Ada and the marriage cert for Lilla and Alfred to see if her father's name really was Arthur.

Which still doesn't answer the question of how and when Joseph James - and almost certainly Wallace - came from the UK to Australia. Wallace is the clincher in many ways - only one Wallace Cornhill (plus his son who died in infancy) appears in the UK GRO indices and there is only one listed in the entire range of census returns. And only one Wallace on the IGI - the same one. 

Never mind - if the certificates show that this IS my Joseph James, I may have to be content with simply noting that "Emigrated to Australia between 1883 and 1887"....

Thanks to everyone for the help!

[sparrett]

Hi'
Not sure if you know of this researcher looking at Ropes of Dubbo.

There is the marriage to Cornhill listed and some births, including Ernest E.

http://members.pcug.org.au/~cfield/distantf/FOUR8.htm


Perhaps it is your own website!



Sue

[wdurham]

Hi, Sue -

Thanks for the heads-up on this one.

It's interesting because it makes the distinction between Lilla May as the daughter of Ada, and Susan and Ernest as the children of Ada and Joseph James.

I may contact the family to see what their sources are - none are detailed on the website that I can find. If they have the certificates, then there may be more info available.

Regards
Wendy

[sparrett]

Yes,
It suggests  the possibility of a liason for Mary Ada before the others were born.

  But then again, the two of them [Mary Ada and Joseph]  had children well before their marriage in 1891, so it could well be Joseph is  father of all.

However the dates you give.. thinking Joseph would still be in UK... make fathering of Lila May Rope a bit short on the  time scale and why would he not acknowledge her if she belonged to him.  He had no trouble sharing his name with the next two!.
Sue
Sue