Marriage John PENROSE - Philippa POLGLASE

[brissygal]

Can anyone help with finding marriage of John Penrose to Philippa Polglase born 21 Jul 1840 Breage/Germoe? 1841 to 1851 Philippa is in Cornwall. 1861 & 1871 she is with sister in Camborne then in Dalton in Furness, Lancashire. 1881 she is married to John Penrose, in Swansea, Wales with 2 children b 1877 & 1880. Later 2 more sons in Cardiff.

The John I have been tracing (christened 1826 St Agnes) seems now to be the wrong one  - I just discovered he married a Jane Martin from St Agnes in 1851. They are together with family in Blowing House, Mithian, Perranzabuloe in 1861. Jane is back in Barkle Shop, Mithian in 1871 listed as widow. Did John die, OR did he desert Jane, later meeting up with Philippa Polglase and marrying her - would fit a family 'scandal story' where she, a teacher, ran off with a travelling minstrel? 

If anyone can help I would be most grateful as we seem to be STUCK.  Have quite a bit of info on the John Penrose from St Agnes, and his siblings and parents, uncles/aunts, grandparents, if anyone is interested. 

Thank you for any help.
Brissygal, Australia   

[Barbara F]

Hi and welcome to Rootschat
No luck so far with the marriage but this looks like her baptism

Breage 21-Aug 1843
Philippa POLGLASE
Parents John and Ann
Residence Germo
Father's occupation Miner

Will continue looking

Barbara

[brissygal]

Thanks - that was fast.
I have most of Philippa's details, except the marriage. The children's birth certificates list her as Philippa Penrose (formerly Polglase) so I presume they WERE married. Husband John is listed as a Confectioner if my memory is correct. But which John - there are hundreds of John Penroses in Cornwall. He died in Cardiff in 1902 - would a Welsh death certificate have any significant details that could help?   
Brissygal 

[Barbara F]

Hello again Brissygal
No luck with the marriage so far - maybe they didn't get married.
Unfortunately English and Welsh death certificates give no information on parents - unless a parent registers the death or the death is of a child. in which case the certificate will usually state son/daughter of name + occupation.
I think the thing to do about John is to track him back through the censuses making a careful note of his age, occupation and place of birth. Then you will gradually have to eliminate all the John Penroses that don't fit. I will have a look and see what I can establish.
The marriage certificate would have been really helpful of course!
Barbara

[toni*]

Phillipa Polglase Helston Q2 1878 5C 276

i have trawled through ancestry BMD 1871 - 1881 and this is the only Phillipa Polglase marrying between those years.

[brissygal]

Thanks Toni*. I checked that one out a while back, and that Philipa doesn't marry a John Penrose. I have considered they may not have married, but would the children's birth certificates say "Penrose, formerly Polglase" if there was no official marriage? Could the marriage have been a non-conformist marriage?  Would it still have to show up in the bmd registers then? (I presume it would.) Thanks again for any help.
 

[krisesjoint]

Hi brissygirl,

Welcome 

Hope the marriage turns up. That would certainly be a bonus. Yes non conformist marriages are certainly listed in the index. Hopefully the other Penrose researchers will be able to help with elimination.

For starters tracking the correct John Penrose we find him in Glamorgan 1881 and then Monmouthshire 1891 and Glamorgan 1901. He is not being very cooperative re age age POB unfortunately.

1881 aged 50 born Cornwall Confectioner 69 Eystll St Upper Pentire St Johns Swansea RG11/5355 Folio 12 Page 17

1891 aged 64 born Cornwall Confectioner 28 Park Row Tredegar Bedwellty RG12/4355 Folio 56 Page 12

1901 aged 78 born Truro Cornwall Confectioner 24 Moira St St Mary Cardiff RG13/4980 Folio 90 Page 34

Death in Mar 1/4 1902  11A 223 lists his age as 77

John and Philippa have 4 sons Charles Edwin, Frederick George, Joseph Henry and Richard Thomas

I can see no sign of him in Wales in 1871 so here's hoping he will be a confectioner in England  prior to 1881.

Cheers Kris 

[deb usa]

Hi everyone

I want to join in ...    ...I am away for a week ... but have "spoken" to Brissygirl after she finished reading the "Cornish Mystery" .... thought I would post so that I can be in on the search.

I have also checked the marriages...the closest I could come was a Philippa Pascoe to a John Penrose in 1869 .  I was wondering if she had been married prior to John penrose and had decided not to say ...LOL

I also checked against the marriage in 1878 that Toni had found to either RT Gilbert or JJ Arthur...looking for a Philippa Arthur or Gilbert marrying a John Penrose ...No luck there either.

good luck ...I will be back

Deb 

[krisesjoint]

Oh Deb,

I was waiting for you to join me all day.    Been wondering where you were, a mystery and no Deb about, just doesn't seem right. Have a nice holiday. 

Sorry to report I have had no luck in England or Wales I am afraid. No marriage and no confectioner anywhere.............Kris