Holywell parish records

[Ninian]

I'm looking for the baptism of Richard Jones in Holywell Parish Church in 1828/29.

Can anyone help me please?

[wrjones]

How do you know for definite that the Baptism took place at Holywell Parish Church?

Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.

[Ninian]

Well, I'm not 100% sure but I have his original marriage certif of 1855 and he was married in Holywell parish church.  Also the family are from Bagillt (from at least mid 1700s up to today) and Bagillt was part of Holywell parish in the 1820s and the church in Bagillt was not built til much later, so the parish church in Holywell was the 'local' church.  So it seemed a fair bet that Richard was baptised there?  Do you think I'm on the wrong track?   

[wrjones]

Your not necessarily on the wrong track,but I am quite curious about your Jones Family,as I also have a Jones bloodline from Bagillt!Do you have any Hughes,Humphreys,Price or Evans from Bagillt?

Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
wrexham.

[Ninian]

Oh right, that's interesting.  I have got some Prices (but rather distant) and not the others. 

My Granmother was Marguarite Roberts nee Jones. She was born in Bagillt and both sides of her family have been in and around Bagillt for quite a few generations.  Her parents were Hugh Jones and Sarah Davies.  Hugh's father was the Richard Jones I am seeking, his father being Samuel Jones.  Sarah Jones nee Davies's father was Thomas Davies - but it doesn't sound as if you have any Davieses so I won't bore you with them.

Anyway, here's a bit of info from my database (apologies as the formatting has gone to pot)  do you recognise the family at all??  The Price connection is through Hugh Joneses sister Eleanor (see 1871 census below) marrying a Thomas Price one of their granddaughters (a Lewis) still lives in Bagillt.



1871 Census - Bagillt, Flintshire, Wales - RG10/5641/69/18
   
Richard   JONES   H   43   M   Engine Driver  Holywell, Flint
MargaretJONES   W   38   M                            Holywell, Flint
Eleanor   JONES   D   11   -   Scholar     Holywell, Flint
Samuel   JONES   S   9   -   Scholar     Holywell, Flint
Hugh   JONES   S   7   -   Scholar     Bagillt, Flint
Mary   JONES   D   2   -   -               Bagillt, Flint
LlewelynJONES   S    11m   -   -               Bagillt, Flint


MARRIAGE:1890
JONES Hugh DAVIES Sarah Holywell, Civil Marriage Flintshire HOL/20/E81
Marriage cerificate:
30 July 1890

Hugh Jones   26 yrs    B                Assayer     Bootgate Cottage,Bagillt 
Father:  Richard Jones  Engineer
Sarah Davies 26 yrs    S                      -            Coetia Llwyd Farm           
Father:  Thomas Davies     Farmer                             Bagillt Road, Holywell
Witnesses:  Samuel Jones (likely to be his older brother);   Margaret Ellen Davies (likely to Sarah's younger sister)
Entry No. 81 Ebenezer, Walwen, Bagillt in the District of Holywell.

1891 Census - 1 Sea View Cottage, Holywell, Flintshire, Wales - RG12/4605/122/19
   
Hugh   JONES   H   27   M   Lead Assayer  Bagillt, Flint
Sarah   JONES   W    27   M    -                  Birkenhead, Cheshire
* all speak Welsh only

1901Census - River View, Holywell, Flintshire, Wales - RG13/5210/65/14
   
Hugh           JONES   H   34   W   Weigher    Bagillt,
Marguarite   JONES   D   9   -             Bagillt,
Thomas Wesley   JONES   S   8   -           Bagillt,
Rhydwen   JONES   S   4   -            Bagillt,    
Ann            JONES   Sis   22   U   Housekeeper            Bagillt,
* all speak both, except for Rhydwen - Welsh only

(Marguerite had other brothers: Richard Neville and Tecwyn.  Dick Neville's son farmed at Fishpool Farm in Bagillt until about 10 years ago).

Does any of this tie in with your Joneses/Prices etc?

Ninian
formerly of Flintshire,
now in S Wales
 

[wrjones]

The IGI in an entry extracted from the local Parish Registers,lists the Christening of a Richard Jones on the 17th of August 1828,to Parents Samuel and Grace Jones.As far as my own Families from Bagillt,I have an Eleanor Jones born  to Parents Edward and Hannah Jones of Bagillt in 1815.She married an Isaac Evans at Holywell in 1836.I have made very little progress though with my wider Jones family from Bagillt.Again another line which I have made virtually no progress with is that of a Jane Price who married a Thomas Hughes of Bagillt at Holywell in c 1768.I do have both Roberts and Davies Families but they are from Flint.

Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.

[Ninian]

Many thanks for the info on Richard's baptism - its definately him.  His parents were indeed Samuel Jones(from Holywell) and Grace (from Llanrwst).  Now I know that Richard was baptised there I think it's pretty likely that I'll find others of the family in the Holywell parish records and a trip to Hawarden Registry Office will definately be a trip worth making in the summer.

Re your Joneses/Davieses/Robertses.  I'm sure there is no connection between our Davieses and Robertses as my Davieses are Bagillt and my Robertses are Merioneth - but your Eleanor is interesting. 

I haven't yet got far enough back to check if my line has an Eleanor born in 1815 but there are quite a few Eleanors in my Jones line (something of a family name in fact) - which could well indicate that there just may be a connection.  Both my Richard Jones and his father Samuel Jones had daughters that they named Eleanor.  I haven't got any further back than Samuel yet -  but I just wonder if it is possible that Samuel's parents were your Edward and Hannah Jones - you don't happen to know if Eleanor had an elder brother called Samuel born 1802ish?   I know it's a bit of a long shot - but you never know ........

Ninian

[wrjones]

Other possible Baptisms of children born to Samuel and Grace on the IGI;
Mary,Baptised 25.01.1830
Llewelyn,Baptised 20.04.1834.
Eleanor,Baptised 28.02.1837.
These three were Baptised at Chester Road Holywell,Wesleyan Methodist,to Parents named Samuel Jones and Grace Williams.
The following two are also listed as children of Samuel and Grace Jones,and they were Baptised at St Mary's Bagillt;
Caroline,Baptised 25.03.1842.
Edward,Baptised 25.07.1847.
As afr as Samuel Jones's Baptism,which may be around 1805,I have a look when I next go to the Clwyd FHS Resource Centre.

Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.

[Ninian]

Thank you very much for these - they tie in beautifully with my census info:

1841 Census - March Cottages, Bagillt fawr, Holywell, Flintshire, Wales - HO107/1413/1/69/22

Forename   Surname   Age   Occupation   Born in County?   
Samuel     JONES      35   M Lab        Yes   
Grace        JONES      35   -                  Yes   
Richard     JONES      18(13)   -                  Yes   
Mary          JONES      11   -                  Yes   
Elizabeth   JONES      9              -                  Yes   
Llewelyn   JONES      7   -                  Yes   
Eleanor          JONES      4   -                  Yes   
Sarah        JONES      2   -                  Yes   
trans as JUNCO

1851 Census - Walwen, Holywell, Flintshire, Wales - HO107/2500/315/7
   
Samuel   JONES   H   49   M   Engineer   Holywell, Flint   
Grace   JONES   W   45   M   Engineer’s Wife   Llanrwst,    
Richard   JONES   S   22   U   Engineer   Holywell, Flint   
Ellen   JONES   D   18   U   ? at Home   Holywell, Flint
LlewelynJONES   S   16   -   Son            Holywell, Flint   
Sarah   JONES   D   11   -   Scholar     Holywell, Flint   
Robert   JONES   S   6   -   Scholar     Holywell, Flint   
Edward   JONES   S    3   -   -                    Holywell, Flint

1871  Bryn Cellin(?), Greenfield, Holywell, Flintshire, Wales - RG10/5641/39/10

   Surname   Age   Status      Occupation                     Born   
Samuel   JONES   H   69   M   Engine Driver                     Holywell,
Grace   JONES   W   65   M                                     Llanrwst,
LlewelynJONES   S   37   U   Engine Driver                     Holywell,
Robert   JONES   S   25   Widower   Bricklayer                  Holywell,
Edward   JONES   S    23   U      Engine Driver          Holywell,
Caroline   JONES   D   19   U    ?Folder in printing office     Holywell,
ElizabethJONES   Niece    3                        -        Holywell,

Mary, Llewellyn, Eleanor and Edward are all there and although there is a Caroline she was younger than the Caroline baptised in 1847 - a strong possibility must be that the original Caroline died before the 1851 census and a later daughter was named Caroline.

Also interesting that some were baptised in the Wesleyan Methodist chapel and some in church - the family from the next generation on were all Wesleyans.

I didn't know that Grace was called Williams - so now I have her maiden name I can start trying to find her in Llanrwst.  I'm very grateful.

Just one other thing - I've just had a look at the Clwyd Family Hist site - it must be very handy for you but do you think it would be worth my while joining?  I'm not likely to be able to get to their meetings or probably not even to the Centre - but would there be any advantages in joining do you think?  I know it's only £10 to join but I've only just started on my family history and it's proving quite expensive already.

Ninian