Pedley Look up please

[Valda]

If the birth certificate for William Pedley says Rhea Street then it would match to the 1881 census Pedley family with mother recorded as Bridget, despite the fact on the certificate itself her name is given as Ellen. This is the family in Rhea Street on the census. If William's birth was after census night 3rd April 1881 it would be after the census was taken.

On the 1881 census James and Ellen Pedley with their son William aged 5 were in Vauxhall Street.

Births Mar 1876  
Pedley  William James     Birmingham  6d 137

Is the suggestion that the birth certificate held by Louise's cousin is really for William James and that the father's name was given as William for some reason and though the birth was registered as William James, Louise's cousin has forgotten to mention the James in his name??

The birth of William Pedley in 1878 registered in Aston

Births Mar 1878  
PEDLEY  William     Aston  6d 371

is the William Pedley aged 3 birth place Aston, living at 10 Coleman Street Birmingham in 1881 with parents John and Ann.

The Rhea Street census of 1881 is a match for the 1891 census - details already posted and for the 1901 census.

RG13 2843 folio 136
62½ New John Street Birmingham  Warwickshire  
Joseph Pedley 55  Birmingham, Warwickshire, Head  Widower Spoon forger
Joseph Pedley  22  Birmingham, Warwickshire,  Son  Brass dresser
William Pedley 19  Birmingham, Warwickshire,  Son  Cycle polisher

The most likely other births and deaths for this Joseph's known children are

Births Mar 1879  
Pedley  Joseph     Birmingham  6d 135

Deaths Dec 1884  
Pedley  Charlotte  8  Birmingham  6d 2

and possibly

Births Sep 1876  
Pedley  Charlotte     Aston  6d 275

These certificates would in the case of the births and possibly in the case of Charlotte's death if her mother registered it, give you the name/s of the mother. Her full name including her maiden name should appear on the birth certificates, but it looks like in the case of William's birth she chose to 'fudge it', or else the registrar has made an error.

I have yet not been able to find Joseph on the 1871 census. Since Bridget/Ellen was born in Ireland it is possible that Joseph married her there, if for instance he served for a spell as a young man in the army. Alternatively they may never have got around to marrying. The missing marriage is not really as perplexing as the missing death registration, since supposedly Bridget/Ellen died between 1881 and 1891. People don't have to get married, but they do have to have their death registered to get a burial.

Regards

Valda

[leelou]

On Joseph and Roseanne Prentice's Wedding certificate of 1907
Josephs father, Joseph Pedley was a spoon forger. - confirms census 1881. He was deceased by 1907.

Roseanna Prentice's father was Richard, and a carter. She was born c 1884.

louise

[indiapaleale]

Well, this Bridget/Ellen thing is a right mystery!

And, I don't know how we will solve it if she didn't give her maiden name on the birth cert...how odd!

If it was me, I would get the marriage cert and birth cert for William's brother, Joseph, just to confirm that we are talking about the same family.

The reason I say that is because I have at least one incorrect marriage cert in my tree. A relative was raised by his uncle and put his uncle down as his father on the marriage cert!....Grr very confusing.

If Grandma says that Bridget/Ellen was from Ireland then that is a good indicator that you are on the right track.

Now as far as 1871. I think I have found Joseph the spoon forger and he is listed as George Pedley the spoon forger! Living at Cheapside in Aston as a lodger with the Johnson family. He is 26 and unmarried. I have been unable to find this George the spoon forger on other census. It is not unusual for lodgers to be enumerated incorrectly!
RG10/3134  Folio 148 Page 19

Cheers
Indi

[leelou]

Thanks Indi

As said previous I have the marriage certificate for Joseph - Williams brother. I will order Joseph's birth cert -

Joseph Pedley 1879 Birmingham Jan - March 6d 135

William Pedley birth certificte - the one belonging to cousin John  - dob 29/04/1881 - Birmingham ? a reminder please

regards Louise.

[Valda]

Deaths Mar 1906
Pedley  Joseph  59  Birmingham  6d 144

Age on death would give a birth year of circa 1847 which is within a 'yearish' of the age given on the 1901 census. 1891 and 1881 censuses are consistent. No matching birth registration on FreeBMD which is almost complete for this period.

1851 census HO107 2060 folio 374?
29 Cheapside Aston  Warwickshire
William Pedley 60  Birmingham, Warwickshire,  Head Married Spoon stamper
Charlotte Pedley  48 Aston, Warwickshire,  Wife Married  
Charles Edward 19 Birmingham, Warwickshire, Stepson Spoon maker
George Edward  14  Birmingham, Warwickshire, Stepson Spoon maker
Joseph Pedley  5  Birmingham, Warwickshire,  Son  

Marriages Dec 1861  
Edwards  Charlotte     Birmingham  6d 273  
Pedley  William     Birmingham  6d 273

The late marriage would make Joseph's birth more likely to have been registered in the surname Edwards.

1861 census RG9 2171 folio 94
No3 House 27 Court Cheapside Aston  Warwickshire
William Pedley 70  Birmingham, Warwickshire,  Head Married Iron spoonmaker
Charlotte Pedley  60  Birmingham, Warwickshire, Wife Married  
George Edwards  29 Birmingham, Warwickshire,  Son-in-law Married iron spoon maker  
Elizabeth Edwards 28  Liverpool, Lancashire, Wife Married  
Henry Edwards  2  Liverpool, Lancashire, Son  
Elizabeth Edwards  3mths Liverpool, Lancashire, Daughter  
Joseph Pedley  18  Birmingham, Warwickshire,  Son Wood Turner

1871 census RG10 3146 folio 30
Back of 29 Holt Street Aston  Warwickshire  
Charlott Pedley  70 Birmingham, Warwickshire, Boarder Widow Shoebinder

There is a possibility that because of Joseph's illegitimate birth he could appear in records as Pedley or Edwards.

William Pedley's birth 29/04/1881 was born in Rhea Street (hence not on census night 3rd April) and was the son of Joseph and 'Ellen'. William son of John (the spoon polisher) and Ann was born in Aston in 1878.

Regards

Valda

[jim1]

Charlotte Taylor married Henry Edwards 1819.In 1841 cen.Henry is listed as 50 and Charlotte 38.There are 4 deaths registered in the first half of 1840's so Henry could be any one of those.It's looking likely Joseph was William's natural child as they didn't marry until 1861 and seems unlikely Joseph would have been given the Pedley name particularly as there were older siblings at home.

Jim

[leelou]

Just had email from cousin John.

He has just found out that Grandad Pedleys mothers surname was Curry. !!!???  So Ellen nee Curry is Williams mom, but the woman on the census is Bridget!

The address on the birth certificated is 3 Court Rea Street South. 26th April 1881.  Census match.

Amazing how he has just found this - by looking at the certificate properly!

Louise

[indiapaleale]

Hi Louise,

Well, this gets curiouser and curiouser!

In 1871 there is only one Ellen Curry living in Birmingham. She is aged 19 and from Ireland. She works as a tinner. and is lodging with a Mary Cormally (sp)
AND, when I look at the image, also living there is Bridget Curry, aged 26, from Ireland and working as a tinner.

I have looked for a marriage for either Curry to a Pedley but no luck.

I was wondering if Ellen was the mother of William and she died and then Bridget (her sister?) is the mother of Joseph?

There is a death of an Ellen Curry in Birmingham in 1879 but the age is way out  - of course the age could be incorrect.

The plot thickens!     
Cheers
Indi


PS...added.....And of course......I could be barking up the wrong tree it could be a totally different Ellen Curry!

[jim1]

Indi....In 1881 Bridget is aged 37 which is consistent with your 1871 info. but Joseph is the older child with William being born 1881 ( mother Ellen ) so the Ellen death must be someone else.
Has the census enumerator got it wrong leaving out Ellen and making Bridget wife instead of sister-in-law.
Louise.....I take it your not kissin' cousins.

Regards
Jim