Author Topic: CARVER Ramblings  (Read 53215 times)

Offline Nick Carver

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Re: CARVER Ramblings
« Reply #180 on: Monday 21 April 08 09:09 BST (UK) »
Tom

I descend from James Carver of Hardley (1788-1851), son of Thomas. James had four sons and three of them, John, William and Daniel moved up to Hull. It would seem John went first and started in Leeds before getting to Hull in the 1840s (typical Industrial Revolution migration) where his brothers followed him. John is my gg grandfather. If you can work out a relationship on that basis, good luck to you. PM me with an e-mail address and I'll send you a file with some details. I still live in E Anglia - in Cambs, but very close to the Suffolk/Norfolk border

Nick
E Yorks - Carver, Steels, Cross, Maltby, Whiting, Moor, Laybourn
W Yorks - Wilkinson, Kershaw, Rawnsley, Shaw
Norfolk - Carver, Dowson
Cheshire - Berry, Cooper
Lincs - Berry
London/Ireland/Scotland/Lincs - Sullivan
Northumberland/Durham - Nicholson, Cuthbert, Turner, Robertson
Berks - May
Beds - Brownell

Offline Tommy C

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Re: CARVER Ramblings
« Reply #181 on: Monday 21 April 08 12:51 BST (UK) »
Nick

Thanks, I can’t see any obvious link.

I believe my ggg grandfather was Jonathan Carver (b.1831 Hardley, Norfolk and married to Esther) and I suspect his brother was William Carver (b.1826 Mundham, Norfolk.) although I can’t find them together on any census so more work is needed. However, Jonathan’s father was Jonathan b.1801 and his father was Thomas b.1753 in Langley, Norfolk which is next to Hardley. I wonder if your James Carver and my Jonathan were brothers…pure speculation, no evidence yet so I’ll send you that PM.

Thanks again.

Tom

Offline Nick Carver

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Re: CARVER Ramblings
« Reply #182 on: Monday 21 April 08 13:55 BST (UK) »
Check out the link I gave you. I suspect your Jonathan's father (also Jonathan) was born 1798, not 1801 and he was the brother of my James Carver. I am in touch with several people from that branch of the family
E Yorks - Carver, Steels, Cross, Maltby, Whiting, Moor, Laybourn
W Yorks - Wilkinson, Kershaw, Rawnsley, Shaw
Norfolk - Carver, Dowson
Cheshire - Berry, Cooper
Lincs - Berry
London/Ireland/Scotland/Lincs - Sullivan
Northumberland/Durham - Nicholson, Cuthbert, Turner, Robertson
Berks - May
Beds - Brownell

Offline Easby Carver

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Re: CARVER Ramblings
« Reply #183 on: Thursday 08 May 08 18:06 BST (UK) »
Jan,

Can I just check something with you please.

The reference of the wheelwrighting apprenticeships to Hitchin St. Mary - where it refers to Carver Sam Thos.  Could this be referring to separate individuals?   I.e Not Samuel Thomas Carver but a Samuel & Thomas Carver?

The reference to apprenticeship was plural...just a thought.

Neil.


Offline janan

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Re: CARVER Ramblings
« Reply #184 on: Thursday 08 May 08 22:35 BST (UK) »
Hi Neil

Now that is something I never thought of  :D Re-reading the other entries unless there was anyone called Thos Eliz, Geo Mary and suchlike then yes Saml Thos may well be two people! So what happened to Thomas - brother presumably of Samuel?

Jan ;)
ALL CENSUS DATA INCLUDED IN POSTINGS IS CROWN COPYRIGHT, FROM  www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

bedfordshire - farr, carver,handley, godfrey, newell, bird, emmerton, underwood,ancell
buckinghamshire- pain
cambridgeshire- bird, carver
hertfordshire- conisbee, bean, saunders, quick,godfrey
derbyshire- allsop, noon
devon - griffin, love, rapsey
dorset- rendall, gale
somerset- rendall, churchill
surrey/middlesex - douglas, conisbee, childs, lyon groombridge

Offline Easby Carver

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Re: CARVER Ramblings
« Reply #185 on: Friday 09 May 08 17:07 BST (UK) »
Hmmmm.

The Thomas who married Susan Turner would seem to be ruled out as he married her in 1746 in Lower Gravenhurst and she died in 1760 in Southill.  The apprenticeship was in 1754, between these dates.

Neil.

Offline Easby Carver

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Re: CARVER Ramblings
« Reply #186 on: Sunday 11 May 08 12:32 BST (UK) »
Hi Jan et al,

Something else has occurred to me for the first time (I must stop doing this!).  It's about the will of William Carver the yeoman labourer who died in Dunton in 1759.

If I understand this correctly, it references two sons John and Peter and the current consensus is that this William Carver is the father of 'Everton John'.  A problem here is we do not have this Peter identified but we do know of a John (Everton John).  I suggest that William Carver is referring to his grandchildren in the will and not his sons. 
 
I say this because William Carver died in early August 1759 in Dunton.   Just three weeks earlier Peter Carver, aged 3, the son of Everton John, dies in Dunton.  we have no other known Peter Carver alive at this point.   ‘Merrington’ John would have been approximately one year old at his grandfather’s death – assuming his baptism in 1758 was close to his birth. 

All the male elder siblings of Peter and John in the summer of 1759 are dead (William died in 1750).  Would anything be left to the female siblings? (Elizabeth, Mary and Ann).  I suggest not which would explain why they do not appear in William’s will.

 William almost certainly would not have had a chance to alter his will in the three weeks between Peter’s death and his own, especially if succumbed to the same illness as Peter.  With a contagious disease raging in the village, who would want to see anybody about a new will who was from this village?   In this way we can fully account for the ‘missing’ Peter.

On the above basis the will makes absolute sense if William left things to his grandchildren and not his son John.  It would all fit.  Now, I haven’t seen the will and the probate record.    There is so much flying about that I may have missed this suggestion elsewhere – apologies if I have.     Do we know when the will was written?

Your witness m’lud...

Neil.

Offline janan

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Re: CARVER Ramblings
« Reply #187 on: Sunday 11 May 08 14:04 BST (UK) »
Hi Neil

Sorry to put paid to your theory

William of Dunton's will of which I have a copy was written 17 Sep 1748, (there is another one proved 1760 which I looked at  but it appeared the same as the 1748 one, now wonder if there were alterations I didn't notice) - in it he makes bequests to
'wife Ann Carver'
'eldest son John Carver'
'youngest son Peter Carver'
'daughters Mary and Sarah Carver'

I can see baptisms for all these children plus William and another Sarah (b1826 bur1827). Can't see baptisms for the Elizabeth and Ann you mention - do you have them? There is no mention of William in the will and since John is said to be eldest son then William should have died before 1748 - a bit puzzling as I can't see another Beds burial for him other than 1750 one, maybe he moved out of county. If so who is the William buried Dunton 21 Feb 1750? And what happened to youngest son Peter?

A Peter Carver married Eliz Mayze in Tempsford 1747 and they had 3 daughters , Elizabeth Mary and Ann - no other Carver/Calver activity in Tempsford so think this is most likely the youngest son of William

I will have a further dig

Jan ;)

This thread now contains a mass of information and has become rather unwieldy and confusing - when I have time to go through it I will try to extract info for a summary. I might later lock this thread and start another.
ALL CENSUS DATA INCLUDED IN POSTINGS IS CROWN COPYRIGHT, FROM  www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

bedfordshire - farr, carver,handley, godfrey, newell, bird, emmerton, underwood,ancell
buckinghamshire- pain
cambridgeshire- bird, carver
hertfordshire- conisbee, bean, saunders, quick,godfrey
derbyshire- allsop, noon
devon - griffin, love, rapsey
dorset- rendall, gale
somerset- rendall, churchill
surrey/middlesex - douglas, conisbee, childs, lyon groombridge

Offline Easby Carver

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Re: CARVER Ramblings
« Reply #188 on: Sunday 11 May 08 18:19 BST (UK) »
Hi Jan,

Thanks for this.  I can see the Tempsford baptisms now. 

I have a baptism for an Elizabeth at Dunton for 30th March 1746 to John and Mary.   
I have a baptism for an Ann at Dunton for 11th February 1753 to John and Mary.

I have a baptism for William at Dunton 7th May 1749 to John and Mary.  I have presumed this William died 21st February, 1750.

Neil.