Where is he?

[DS]

Pam

I think that I was instrumental in encouraging you to believe that your William married Lucy Baker: had Charles: Lucy died and then he married Harriet etc. The bits of information which are available online from the 1861 census to the 1871 census (and the lack of any contra evidence) all point to that probably being the case.

However, I have just seen Gwynne's message which seems to shatter that theory and I want to apologise, publicly and profusely, if I have caused you to follow the wrong path. 

At the start of this thread one of the problems that was highlighted was the inability to find a birth registration for a Charles Smith born in 1853 (ish) in Bridgnorth. That, in itself, seemed a bit odd. If, from Gwynne’s information, we have to conclude that the Charles shown in 1861 with your William and the one shown in 1871 with his grandparents (the Bakers) are not the same person then it seems ultra odd that there are two missing birth registrations in Bridgnorth in 1853 for children called Charles Smith who each had a father called William.

I wonder (being a bit cheeky) if Gwynne, with his special knowledge of Bridgnorth matters, could possibly look into this aspect for you? If one (or two) birth records could be found, it might help to remove some of the confusion.

DS

[pamty12]

Hi Ds,
Thanks for the reply. I am trying to sort out all info. (with my very limited knowledge of the way things work in genealogy) from all you kind peeps. It is unfortunate that there were alot of William Smiths in Hereford and Worcester at that time. I also feel a bit guilty that everyone has been trying so hard to slove my problem.
Regards
Pam

[Puffcat]

Pam, we all enjoy a mystery and a challenge - that is why we indulge ourselves with genealogy. 

Now you have a lot of bits of jigsaw, some correct, some tentative, go back to basics. Link from your family back using Census etc and what you know to be accurate. then you can eliminate the ones that cannot be your family, and try to fit in all the ones that are.
Don't get hung up on ages unless they are way out, the 1841 census is accurate to the nearest 5 years. So ladies always reduced their ages on that !  ::)But ages on records are not necessarily accurate.
The most accurate are likely to be the Birth, Marriage and Death Certificates from the Register Offices, but even they are fallible.

[pamty12]

Hi EBN,
Thanks for that note. I have started with requesting the marriage cert. for William and Harriet, If William was married before it should say widower on the cert. I will then also have the parents names.
Any ideas as how to proceed after that?
Pam

[Puffcat]

Now here's a name to conjour with ! 
William Bowen Ambrose SMITH baptised at Claines 25/3/1860 some of William SMITH and Harriet....

[Puffcat]

1881 census at  8 Gregory Terrace Claines

Harriet SMITH Widow aged 42 born Hallow Laundress
William Smith son Unmarr aged 20 born Claines Baker
John Smith        ..      ..       aged 18 born Claines Gardener
Ellen Smith dau         ..       aged 12     ..      ..       Scholar
George Smith sone  aged 7                 ..      ..            ..
Harriet Smith Dau aged 4                    ..      ..            ..

[pamty12]

Hi,

Yes I have that one from 1861 census., there can't be too many of those around. Pity he isn't the one I want!!
I also have 1881 and 1891 census for Henry Hooper who is/ was my great grandfather. Henry appears on 1861 aged 4.
Pam

[Valda]

It depends what surname Charles had his birth registered in whether his birth registration is missing or not.

1861 census RG9 2109 folio 39
Claines  Worcestershire  
William Smith 47 Much Marcle, Herefordshire,  Head Married Market Gardener
Harriett Smith 26  Hallow, Worcestershire, Wife  Married
Charles Smith  8  St Mary, Shropshire, Son  
Harry Smith  4  Claines, Worcestershire,  Son  
Wm Ambrose Smith  1  Claines, Worcestershire,  Son    
Wm Smith  25  Hallow, Worcestershire,  Lodger Unmarried Ag lab

WILLIAM SMITH  
HARRIETT HOOPER  
Marriage:  25 AUG 1858   Claines, Worcester
 
HARRY SMITH HOOPER  
Christening:  19 APR 1857   Claines, Worcester
Mother:  HARRIET HOOPER  

June 1857 Droitwich
Harry Smith Hooper
6c 339

which would mean if the Lucy Smith death registration in Worcester was correct it occurred after the birth of Harry.

Regards

Valda

[pamty12]

Hi Valda,
I have the same 1861 census that you have just posted. The only difference is Harry appears on yours and Henry appears on mine. do you think therefore that the first two children - Charles and Henry/Harry were born to Lucy if in fact William was married before. (I will know for sure in a few days when hopefully I will get the marriage cert. )
that would be interesting as Henry/Harry was my great grandfather.
Pam